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Bang Bang 11-28-2018 08:20 AM


Originally Posted by Griff (Post 4661132)
I would bet you will need at least 600hp to go from 70mph to 80mph

i donīt think i need 600hp. with a wasted 415hp plus stainless marine exhaust it made 70, for 80 i think 530 could be enough, could be 550 on the dyno with dry exhaust and no sea water pump.

Iīm more and more ok with going forward with a 540 rotation kit and bigger heads. Next questions will be do i need a forged crank, how much intake volume should the heads have, any opinions wich rotation kit, wich heads would work? Saw used heads mit 345 cc but think thats too much...

articfriends 11-29-2018 01:05 PM


Originally Posted by hogie roll (Post 4661143)

make sure you understand the difference between dyno trim and in your boat. Highly dependent on your exhaust manifolds and how many pumps you hang off it.

I recently tested my muffled dyno headers against imco powerflows w short risers on a 500efi with bigger tb other wise stock. At 5200 the powerflows gave up 14 hp, at 5400 gave up 21 hp, gained 10 ft lbs tq in midrange below the peak. So we take 20 hp off for decent marine exhaust and another 25 or 30 for no raw water pump, pulleys, hotter intake air in boat etc that 560 quickly turns into about 500/510. Surprisingly a set of Eddie marine manifolds with 19" long risers out performed my imcos in every way, still didn't come close to muffled headers. Open header vs the power flows, we were down 31 hp at 5200 and about 38 at 5400, I cant run open headers here often as I havent built muffler stacks yet plus it inflates the numbers so much there not realistic. I actually bought a set of 1 7/8 headers for dyno to try soon to see if I can pick up torque and kill a little hp over my normal ones so I can mimic what a typical set of performance manifolds do, haven't tryed them yet.

Griff 11-29-2018 01:46 PM


Originally Posted by Bang Bang (Post 4661265)
i donīt think i need 600hp. with a wasted 415hp plus stainless marine exhaust it made 70, for 80 i think 530 could be enough, could be 550 on the dyno with dry exhaust and no sea water pump.

Iīm more and more ok with going forward with a 540 rotation kit and bigger heads. Next questions will be do i need a forged crank, how much intake volume should the heads have, any opinions wich rotation kit, wich heads would work? Saw used heads mit 345 cc but think thats too much...

You will need to add 15-20hp for each 1mph gain in the speed range you are in. The faster you go, the more resistance so to go from 70 to 75 mph, you would need to add about 75 hp. To go from 75 to 80mph, you will need more like another 100hp. The 502mpi is rated 415hp at the prop and would be more like 430hp on the dyno. How much true hp you need would be somewhat dependent on how tired your current engine is.

Crude Intentions 11-29-2018 02:27 PM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4661482)
I recently tested my muffled dyno headers against imco powerflows w short risers on a 500efi with bigger tb other wise stock. At 5200 the powerflows gave up 14 hp, at 5400 gave up 21 hp, gained 10 ft lbs tq in midrange below the peak. So we take 20 hp off for decent marine exhaust and another 25 or 30 for no raw water pump, pulleys, hotter intake air in boat etc that 560 quickly turns into about 500/510. Surprisingly a set of Eddie marine manifolds with 19" long risers out performed my imcos in every way, still didn't come close to muffled headers. Open header vs the power flows, we were down 31 hp at 5200 and about 38 at 5400, I cant run open headers here often as I havent built muffler stacks yet plus it inflates the numbers so much there not realistic. I actually bought a set of 1 7/8 headers for dyno to try soon to see if I can pick up torque and kill a little hp over my normal ones so I can mimic what a typical set of performance manifolds do, haven't tryed them yet.

good write up. Those numbers get even worse with horsepower and rpm. Most people devalue exhaust in a build and the effects it has. Especially from a full open dyno headers to a standard manifold. Naturally the losses are mitigated on NA with better marine exhaust such as sweepers or T&L.

Baja Rooster 11-29-2018 02:36 PM

Great info. Would you consider muffled headers equivalent to wet exhaust or close to it?

Crude Intentions 11-29-2018 02:53 PM


Originally Posted by Baja Rooster (Post 4661491)
Great info. Would you consider muffled headers equivalent to wet exhaust or close to it?

If im remembering the post correctly mark rinda had said that his muffled headers were on par with the longer runner stuff. Like sweepers or T&L.

SB 11-29-2018 05:02 PM

Since the collector is the most important aspect of the headers, the mufflers are an extension of it...so, it depends on the design of the mufflers.

articfriends 11-30-2018 06:10 AM


Originally Posted by Baja Rooster (Post 4661491)
Great info. Would you consider muffled headers equivalent to wet exhaust or close to it?

muffled boat headers or dyno headers? Like i said, at the 530 ish hp level, imco powerflows (with water going into the exhaust stream) were down 21 hp at 5400 vs dry dyno headers w gibson 5" boat mufflers dry. As far as dry boat exhaust muffled vs wet non muffled, idk, Smitty

sutphen 30 11-30-2018 06:35 AM


Originally Posted by articfriends (Post 4661482)
I recently tested my muffled dyno headers against imco powerflows w short risers on a 500efi with bigger tb other wise stock. At 5200 the powerflows gave up 14 hp, at 5400 gave up 21 hp, gained 10 ft lbs tq in midrange below the peak. So we take 20 hp off for decent marine exhaust and another 25 or 30 for no raw water pump, pulleys, hotter intake air in boat etc that 560 quickly turns into about 500/510. Surprisingly a set of Eddie marine manifolds with 19" long risers out performed my imcos in every way, still didn't come close to muffled headers. Open header vs the power flows, we were down 31 hp at 5200 and about 38 at 5400, I cant run open headers here often as I havent built muffler stacks yet plus it inflates the numbers so much there not realistic. I actually bought a set of 1 7/8 headers for dyno to try soon to see if I can pick up torque and kill a little hp over my normal ones so I can mimic what a typical set of performance manifolds do, haven't tryed them yet.

you should try some doug thorley tri y headers,best of both worlds.

articfriends 12-01-2018 07:45 AM


Originally Posted by sutphen 30 (Post 4661596)
you should try some doug thorley tri y headers,best of both worlds.

I bought some 1 7/8 vette headers to try, thinking they will bump bump up tq close to what manifolds made and knock off some top end hp, if they dont, ill buy some other ones. Its a big pia for me to run wet exhaust, we killed a 02 sensor w the Eddie manifolds too. Trying to find something thats as close as possible to numbers manifold made.


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