Sutphen,

Too late. Already made one. :rolleyes:

Thanks. Brad.

Hey Brad, has the dyno run been done?

Patrick

Padraig,

Unfortunately, no. Trust me, I'll be on here giving report.

We are at a point of many tiny "victories", resolving issues that seem to crop up as we piece the raw water, fuel line, oil line and PS line routing back together after reworking the order of the various coolers along the route of the raw water. At this point, the raw water plumbing is done, but only temporarily, since the dyno shop can't accommodate the wet exhaust. We will be doing the dyno session with their shop headers, so well have to block off the hoses that connect to the drain valves below the distribution logs on the exhaust manifolds. A number of plans have had to be revised as the various components come together with these changes, and things are not exactly where we anticipated them. It's all coming together, but the engine being a half-hour drive away is slowing progress on these little issues. I also discovered that, the amazing toolmaker that I am, I made the oil filter block off plate fitting with the wrong threads for the AN portion. So THAT halted progress on the routing of the oil lines until I can make a new one. I am hoping to be able to do that tomorrow or Friday and get the rest of it wrapped up by Saturday. I'm supposed to call the dyno shop and confirm if the dyno is going to be open on Saturday. I'm gonna do that later today. I guess Indy Cylinder Head has a habit of gobbling up their Saturdays, and they call on Wednesday to confirm. If we're a go, It's gonna have to be a$$holes and elbows finalizing anything left to do to make that happen. There ain't much left. Fingers crossed.

Nip/tuck.....

Thanks. Brad.

Good Luck! You have put a lot of work into this rebuild.

Padraig

Padraig,

We certainly have. I keep telling the builder that, one day, we'll both look back on all of this and laaaaugh. :rolleyes:

One of the craziest feats of this whole ordeal has been the HP harness. As I stated previously, while the builder has done a number of Merc 496s, both base and HO, and he's done a TON of builds with Holley EFI modules, this is his first time marrying a Merc 496 WITH the HP (it was his idea, though). So that was a challenge in and of itself. But, on top of that, the harness I got with the ECM was originally intended for a distributor engine. Which means it has something like four wires dedicated to ignition. Being the "let's get it done" kinda guy he is, the builder just dug in and started splicing in all the additional wires for the pinouts for all the ignition coils. He bought the connecter terminal pins and had a friend help him with the soldering (he was having some eyesight issues at the moment). I guess the guy told him, "You know, for about $500, you coulda just bought the right harness." To which, the builder shrugged and said, "But we're here now...." :hitfan:

He's definitely the "Whatever it takes" sort.

Thanks. Brad.

everyone always asks me why I dont take pictures of the stuff I build, I tell them "I dont ever want to look back the the pics and be reminded that I something like that because then I would never do it again"

I admire machinists they have the ability to build dam near anything. I have a friend who has a machine shop and foundry. He has helped me with custom parts and repairs more times then I can count. He has built things that range from the fireplace in Bill Gate's master bedroom to cannons for a replica square rigger sailboat. Oh...the cannons worked.

Padraig

Comped,

Yup. The builder said “I’ll never do THAT again” about the harness.

Thanks. Brad.

Told ya.
Holley would have been plug and play for the most part. Now you have a ton of spliced connections and if one goes bad it won't be easy to find, not to mention if he`s charging by the hour it`s going to cost more than a new harness.
but what do I know.
How`s that $10k budget holding up?

Dan,

Definitely an unforeseen obstacle. He is not charging by the hour. He gave me a flat rate, and we’ve discussed it on a couple occasions; he’s sticking to that. He is charging me for a couple of extras we’ve added on, but the harness is on him. He wanted to do it. Again, he’s not doing this for a living. He enjoys playing with blocks. I have no worries on the splicing. They were done right. There’s damned little more chance of them going bad than there would be for an OEM Holley harness. the aggravating thing is that I had a line on a “jumper” that would have been a direct bridge from the 555 harness to the HP, but the guy never retuned my texts after we spoke to give me a price.

About the budget…. Honestly, I think I’m still under the $10K mark, but I’ve gotta be getting close. I know all the major purchases were WELL under, but the nickel and dimes have to have added up. There have been a couple of decisions made that were not in that initial estimate, too. Honestly, I don’t really wanna add it up. The CFO does. I don’t.

Thanks. Brad.

For him maybe.
Glad it`s not a per HR. charge at least.

Dan,

To be fair, I bought the ECM and harness used, and he had no idea the harness was not going to be a full LS style harness. I can't fault him for that. He could have just tossed it back at me and told me I was going to have to buy the right harness. He's trying to save me some money. He doesn't believe in raking people for everything their worth. Like I said, he enjoys building engines, and he makes enough at his day job to support his needs.

Thanks. Brad.

Guys,

Good, bad or otherwise, we decided to forego the dyno session. There were just too many concessions needed for the dyno shop to be able to run the engine. Between the closed cooling and the wet exhaust, the tune we'd get would have been arbitrary at best, and I felt like we were unravelling too much of the ball of yarn. So, we said farq it and dropped it in the boat this last Sunday. The builder was under some time constraints, and I was getting impatient to get it done, and then we had to take a couple runs at it, removing the oil cooler to make room, which ate up a fair bit of time. In our haste, we forgot the anti-rotation tabbed washers that go between the motor mounts and mounting pads. He had them laying there on the floor, so my guess is he was planning on putting them in place after we got the engine in place, before dropping it down on the mounting pads. But that didn't happen and here we are. So.....

Couple questions... Are they absolutely necessary? It's hard for me to imagine them turning once the motor mount nuts are tightened down, but I also figure there's a reason they are in place to begin with. The builder told me he doesn't use them on his boat and has never had an issue. I know that doesn't make them irrelevant. What's the thoughts on tilting the engine forward and/or sideways enough to get the mounts over the studs enough to sneak them in? There is a fair bit of stud sticking up above the motor mounts, and they seem to be fairly snug clearance over the studs, that might be a challenge; avoiding damaging the mounting pads. It's also been suggested to forego them, mark the nuts and keep an eye on them to see if they are turning. I know I REALLY don't relish the idea of pulling it back out of the boat, but....

Suggestions?

Thanks. Brad.

Pics of the washer you are talking about? If it's what I'm thinking of it's critical for engine to outdrive alignment

Edit: I think you are talking about front motor mounts and I'm talking about rear

Ryan,

Correct. The front motor mounts.

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...b4889847f.jpeg

These thingies. They were bent over the nut before, but I’ve straightened them for adjustment, then they get bent over the nut again.

Thanks.

Did you use any lock tight? You would be amazed what will loosen up in a boat.

Wildman,

I wouldn't think LocTite would work very well, as you would have to apply it before setting the engine, and, by the time you got around to making adjustments, it would have set. Once set, if you turn the nut (assuming you were using a removable formula), you very likely lose the "lock".

Thanks. Brad.

They turn, many engines fall out of adjustment because of those mounts and take out a coupler or transom assembly, bend the tabs over the nut and put a hose clamp around to keep it from spinning

they are important. Boatnt hit the nail on the head. About all you could do is carefully mark the uppers and maybe locktite them so you can see when (not if) the mount drops. You will be able to bring it back up with the lower nut.

Johnny, BoatNT,

As I said, I was assuming to worst; that they exist for a reason. And probably a hard learned reason.

I’m working on it. I have a plan to use a forklift to lift it by the exhaust manifolds just enough to sneak them in place.

Thanks. Brad.

If you can't get those back on, I would either tack weld the nut to the mount, or put a paint mark on it and check it after every other run or so.

Liberator,

Yup. Although I did find some interesting "collet" style locking nuts that would have worked really well, but they would have required the engine to be lifted to get them on, anyhow.

Thanks. Brad.

Guys,

Forklift to the rescue. The plan worked. Tab washers are in place. I had to pull the boat out of my shop and come at it from both sides, as the forklift didn't have the reach to lift the whole engine.

This ended up being a bit of serendipity, anyhow. Turns out, in the course of rerouting the raw water hoses for the new aux cooler setup, one hose had found its way directly below the ProCharger and was pinched against the stringer. I haven't got it completed, but I got a hose from the port side drain valve over the stringer and out of harm's way, so now all I have to do is reconnect to the tee feeding the intercooler, which then goes to the heat exchanger.

We should be all forward movement from here forward. Now the builder gets to come to MY shop for a change.... :rolleyes:

Thanks. Brad.

Id put them in or at least be checking the TQ on the bolts regulatory. I have personally had 2 incidences . First one was 14 or 15 years ago on my first Baja and the engine nuts your talking about. Had both loosen up on it making the engine dance around. I would later find out who ever installed the engine...... They at least put the anti-rotation washers on.... But didn't bent the tabs

Second one was 2 years ago. Same thing but only with the steering! and yes this time the bolt came out and was laying in the bilge. I got super lucky that I was idling at the time. Bolt came out of the rack ram(not sure the official name) that attached to the transom assembly. Drives and steering wheel went to full lock. I had no idea WTF happened, but knew the drives were at full lock and couldn't turn the wheel with a rocky shore coming close. Was in the no wake zone/ narrow channel part of the river. I about chit my pants. Quickly turned the engines off. Buddy saw me and quickly turned around to throw me a line and pulled me to the marina. Found out what happened and the bolt missing. Was in the bilge somewhere with the anti-rotation washer was still in place on the ram.. Once again it was installed, but the tabs were not bent to the bolt. I actually didn't even catch that part. Local performance shop cough it when I sent him photos in case I couldn't fish the bolt out from under the engines. He saw it right away.

Guys,

So next little puzzle…..

Engine is in. Plumbing is buttoned up. Harness is for the most part finalized (a couple grounds need ran to the block and I’m waiting for a FP sender for the ECM). Builder came to my shop last night to align the engine. No deal. We put nearly four hours into it. We were up and down, both sides. All over the place. Even when a visual inspection looked perfect, the alignment tool would kick one way or another at first contact and just never went in much past that point.

I've got a short length of tool steel round bar that measures a couple thousandths larger than the coupler section of the alignment tool, and it fits into the coupler just about perfectly. We were using it for a visual alignment (very rough, I know), but, every time we’d get it what we thought was close, the alignment tool would still just stop when it came in contact with the coupler.

Builder seems to think the gimbal bearing got moved when we pulled the outdrive prior to pulling the engine. I’m going to make up a ring that slip fits over that tool steel shaft with the same OD as the bearing section of the alignment tool to try and get a handle on where we are from the coupler’s perspective, so to speak, rather than that of the bearing.

We've inspected the tool for nicks and dings that might be causing a hang up. All good there.

Any suggestions….?

Thanks. Brad.

Install the alignment tool as best as possible, once in take a dead blow hammer and hit the alignment tool up, down, and side to side this will center the bearing, and then you should be good to go,

the other thing you could do is leave the rear bolts tight on the transom plate and the front mounts off, with your engine lifting device at the front of the engine center, and you could work the engine up and down until the alignment tool slips in

BoatNT,

Are you using the coupler as a fulcrum when doing that?

We tried knocking the bearing around with the alignment tool, similar to what you suggest, but with no engagement with the coupler. Still couldn’t seem to find “straight”. How do you know the bearing is straight if the engine is out of alignment too?

It feels like we’re trying to solve a two factor puzzle, but don’t know which factor needs resolved first.

Thanks. Brad.

It can definitely be tricky sometimes. I usually instead of trying to visually line up the gimbal bearing and coupler, I visually make the bearing look flat on the race first. Also with the alignment tool just in the bearing, i will make sure the bar is perpendicular with the transom and level with the boat. Did you guys put the double would washers under the rear engine mounts along with the felt washer?

Ryan,

I didn’t install the transom ass’y bits, so I don’t know for certain. I’m taking him for his word they are all in there correctly. I will say, though, that we’ve been both low and high, as far as misalignment, so I d say it’s all good on that front.

How do you ensure the bearing is seated square?

Thanks. Brad.

If you have been all the way high, and all the way low with the front mounts, and the bar still doesn't slide in, I would tend to think the back felt washers and spring are missing. The gimbal race is seated square in the transom assembly. The bearing is free to pivot it where you want. With the bearing appearing "square" the alignment bar level with the boat, and perpendicular with the transom, can you get your finger back there to feel where the alignment bar is in relation to the coupler?

You will never get it aligned without those double wound washers

Ryan,

Good to see I’m not the only one up at these stupid hours…..

The felt washers are definitely there, and I’m pretty sure the “springs” are, too.

By “high and low” I mean I’ve seen the bar kick both up and down when the taper at the end of the alignment tool contacts the coupler. That leads me to believe all the bits are there.

”Put your finger in there”…. You mean from the inside, correct? Between the engine and transom ass’y? I’ll have to check. It’s pretty snug back there and the stack up is correct.

For reference, my setup has the “extended” snout coupler. Not sure if this makes a difference.

Thanks. Brad.

Have you guys tried adjusting the front motor mount nuts?

Yes, I like to try and get the alignment bar as square as my eye can visually see, push straight in, then try and feel where the alignment bar and coupler meet inside the bilge to figure out if I'm high, low, or side to side. After i have the bar at least sliding in and out, i use grease marks on the alignment bar to adjust the rest of the way

Ryan,

The front adjustment nuts are what we've been "up and down" all over the place with. There really isn't any adjustment to the rear mounting points, is there?

As of right now, we don't have any entry of the alignment tool into the coupler at all. We can tell which way it's off by, by which way the tool kicks off when it comes into contact with the coupler, but it won't even begin to go into the spline.

Thanks. Brad.

Brad,
If you are starting from scratch, the procedure should be as follows:
1: Slightly loosen the rear mounts
2. Install a 1" bar in the coupler
3. Lift the weight off the engine with a hoist and leveler to hold the engine roughly level and move the engine up and down until the 1" bar is roughly in the center of the gimbal bearing.
4. Adjust the front mount nuts so the lower nuts are just touching the engine mounts, that will ensure they are level with the rear mounts and not trying to twist the engine.
5. Re-torque the rear mounts
6. Remove the engine hoist
7. Install alignment tool and push on it while whacking the back end left, right, up, and down until the alignment bar goes into the coupler
8. Look at the witness marks on the alignment tool and make fine adjustments to the lower mount nuts in equal turns on both sides

Guys,

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...8bb53f20f.jpeg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.off...c5bc4d022.jpeg

So this is what I’ve got. The sleeve has MAYBE .0015” clearance over the ø1” shaft, and the OD is MAYBE .0005” smaller in diameter than the equivalent diameter of the alignment tool, and the shaft is actually bigger by ~.005” than the equivalent diameter of the alignment tool. All in all, it’s a REALLY good representation of the alignment tool that allows me to slip it into the spline first, then slip into the bearing. Fits like a glove. I wouldn’t say it’s perfect, but it’s close. Even if I slip the sleeve into the bearing first, the shaft slips in easily. But the alignment tool….? Ain’t happinin’…. I’ve checked the alignment tool, and it doesn’t appear to have any significant run-out, but I’ve only done a rough check until my bigger lathe is available (sometime this afternoon),

Thoughts….?

Thanks. Brad.

Guys,

Question....

With an UP adjustment on the adjustment nuts, which way does the insertion point of the coupler go? Reasons.....

Thanks. Brad.

Quite frankly it kind of has seemed like black magic voodoo on which way adjustments make. I stopped keeping track and would go by grease marks. If grease marks got farther off, i went the wrong way.

Maybe i misssed it, but is that a new gimbal bearing? If not i would be replacing it while you have it apart.

Up on the adjustment nuts goes down on the coupler.. The rear mounts are kind of like the pivot point and the coupler is aft of the pivot, so its opposite.

AShipShow,

That’s kinda what my thoughts were, thinking like an engineer, but I got what appeared to be the opposite result. I’m tinkering with it now.

So, how would you suggest lifting the front of the engine? The intercooler is mounted on the front lift ring, which is way off to the side, anyhow. Can I loop around the crank pulley with a nylon strap?

Thanks. Brad.