No question, when you combine a small family business with many decades of the old fashioned boat pedigree, you develop an emotional following. Following the long history of threads going way back, the vast majority were started to ask about their paid for boats. What followed was a now familiar pattern, which has once again been repeated.

One thing that I've noticed in a lot of these Pantera threads, is that as you move forward in years, most of the people posting do not own Panteras anymore. Obviously, no more than a few have purchased one in recent years. I found this odd for a boat make that had so many ardent supporters. There are performance brands now that are selling, some have launched new models, many have been delivered. Everyone knows these brands, and a quick look at the threads reveals that many have owned these brands for many years, and move up to new ones. Obviously they like their boats, and continue to do business with the company.

The same is not true for this company. Correct me if I'm wrong, but while emotions run high and the sympathy vote is secure, nobody talks about ordering a new one. The ones that have bought one? Well that's what most of these threads are about. While a lot of folks love the family, like the boats, love the history, they simply don't trust their money with them. If they did, many of the folks that have money would have been ordering Panteras, and done whatever to keep them in business and thriving.

So while you say "Pantera has a loyal following and I'm sure the Pantera fans would like to see the company survive", I see only a sympathy vote based on the old days of history. I've seen no evidence that the "loyal following" is loyal enough to donate a dollar to the cause. Heck, nobody is brave enough to ask what they heck they are doing in between the time the hull and deck are joined, and the bolsters are installed.

For many years, they stated there is no profit in the 28, prices are too low, they do things just to please the customer for which they charge nothing. That sounds pretty dumb to me, especially if you've been doing it for decades. They have (I think) two boats in house now. One that was going to be completed very soon, the other as soon as possible. Those guys have to be scared to death. They don't care if the company has been around since God told them to build the Arc, they only care about their boats which are paid for. It's August now, they filed for bankruptcy, enabling them to conduct business as usual with a little breathing room.

It took many, many years to get to this point, and I think the loyal following has run out of energy. There are now 812 posts in the What Happened to Sneak Peak thread, which was a new thread after the first one turned into embarrassment. It was started in February, six months ago. It was reported by someone that the "factory" was building 3 28's and one 36 at that time. That's a fair amount of coin to have upfront. At this point, while people may wish them well because they are nice people, they have gone elsewhere.

JUP,. i have been a fan of pantera for yrs i have followed berks thread and the others over the years. i have alot of respect for some of the people that have defended the product over the years. but i just cannot wrap my head around going bk for 140k when 100k was pd upfront. im poor and have more than 140k in debt. but only pantera knows how they spent the money recd from there boats. i do wish the best for everyone involved.

That's glazed donut #2 you served up. I like the 41 Pantera, but that would be glazed donut #3. The problem is with Pantera screwing people....that's the issue, and it's huge!

VtSteve, well stated and I agree with you...too many people waited too long and many have been screwed. I would like to see them recoup the lost $$$ or at least get the boat they were promissed. If Pantera stays in business that possibility still exists. But with Pantera's past financial history who would take the risk forking over any money to have a boat built??? It would be nice to see everything resolved and Pantera survive. The family knows how to build a good boat...they just need someone else to manage their business!!

JLN, when a company gets so far behind they start using new money to complete older projects until everything collapses. Eventually someone gets burned. I'm sure in a good boating economy Pantera would've been in much better shape than they are now. Like you (and I'm sure many others) I question where the money went. If I were to write a check for a boat I would want my money to be spent only on the product due me; not distributed to finish other peoples boats!! Back in the late 1990's Active Thunder's outdoor booth at the Miami Boat Show was across from Pantera. I had numerous conversations with Jo and Pepe. They were nice people with alot of pride in their boats..but pride and building a good boat doesn't make you a good businessman. I hope for everyone's sake that things work out.

Was 2002 a good boating economy?

Most business people in Pantera's situation who gave a rats ass about their reputation would use their own capital or get a bank loan secured by personal collateral in order to cover the expense and time involved in building out a customer's boat before they put their customer through boat delivery hell as Pantera has done on many occasions. The Nunez family on the other hand has often placed the monetary burden (and risk) on the backs of their customers and have done so two steps in arrears. In practice it appears they have repeatedly required full payment from their latest customer in order to cover the expense of building their previous customer's boat. It appears that over the years they have repeatedly misled customers about missed delivery dates claiming delays are for production reasons when they were more likely waiting for the next poor soul to plop down full payment in advance to pay for the last guys build.

If the Nunez family was up front and honest about the company being in arrears financially then no one in their right mind would pay up front and risk waiting a prolonged amount of time for delivery. If the Nunez family were stand up people they would tap their own financial resources to complete their customers boat in a reasonable amount of time rather than putting their customers through both financial and emotional hell. Instead, when the next order hasn't come along as soon as hoped and the build drug on for ridiculous amounts of time the Nunez family has repeatedly ran to the protection of the bankruptcy courts thus leaving the Nunez family whole and their customers devastated.

Although the Nunez family have become experts on using the court system to leave themselves whole and their customers not, it does come at a price: Their reputation is CHIT - and rightfully so.

It is just amazing to me that Mr. Nunez has the gull to gleefully announce in this thread that although Pantera has sought bankruptcy protection for the umpteenth time they presently do not owe their suppliers a penny so they are not only able but actually excited about the prospect of starting up this whole game again.

I know there are many people on this planet who lack conscience and given the opportunity will repeatedly screw over anybody, anywhere, anytime; but what continues to amaze me and amaze others who are now warning their fellow boaters about Pantera is that despite an overwhelming mountain of evidence damming Pantera's business practices over a long period some come on here and defend what seems indefensible. It is as much bewildering to some as it is enabling to Pantera.

There it is!

Yup, he found the beef.

just out of curiosity what a 28 , 36 and 41 complete mold's worth these day's $ 200 - $ 250 k ? " maybe "


mike