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Fountain 47, 2372cid single engine diesel

Old 01-26-2020, 11:01 AM
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Woa! Awesome!

You probably know already but water rises pretty close to one 1” for every 12” of set back, at least at 80-90mph range. So ideally you want that water to meet the prop hub right?

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Old 01-26-2020, 11:48 AM
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I can trim drives but yes, whole blade should be in water at neutral trim. there can not be notch under drives, only between drives it is possible and that not affect water rising for props.
Only thing I'm afraid I chance transom lift and boat balance for eliminating notch. And how much drag longer running surface make?
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Old 01-26-2020, 11:56 AM
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I will try to give a little bit of input from experience.

Keep the drives 20” apart. You will not want to limit the diameter of the prop on an unknown project. In the end I bet you use a 18”+ diameter 5 or 6 blade prop.

You do not need a 6 speed transmission. A low gear for around the docks and to spool the turbos and then high for when your on plane, anything else is wasted space and weight that you will never use. you are correct that high gear will need to be 1-1. Anything else will be going through a gear ratio that will be another draw on power and generate heat and possible breakage.

You said you will have better cooling, that is true but harder to keep consistent. You will need to make some custom/ complex thermostat housings and hose/ water flow routing compared to what they had.

Don’t look at tractor pull numbers for any type of comparison to what power you will have or make live. I thought the same thing and the engines would not live for more then a few minutes at 1/2 what the tractor pull guys were making.

I think you will be a little heavier then you think.

if you could put the cross box on the engine then run a separate transmission in front of each drive you would have a backup to make it home if one drive, one prop, or one transmission failed. And it would be easier to maneuver around docks. If you cannot do two transmissions then I would at least do a breakaway clutch or crash box on each side.



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Old 01-26-2020, 12:13 PM
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Old 01-26-2020, 12:33 PM
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Thank you for your interest Tyson, I have read your topic word by word, nice job!


I maybe understand centerline wrong, I mean I can put drives 35-50" between each other, its not limiting prop size. I make it as narrow as possible.

My ZF transmission weigh 150kg (330lbs) and I can't lighten that, it's electronically controlled so I can decide witch gears I use. Maybe three or four max.

Scania make clever thermostat housings with double thermostats, both banks get own housing, they have big enough closed circuit so circulating coolant flow at cold temperatures stay good enough to avoid hot spots. Heat changer should be very good and efficient. It won't come so complicated.

You are absolutely right about tractor pull and drag race, but those sports tell something about parts strenght, what crack or blow and how much stock parts. Heat removal, long period runs and time between overhaul are totally different story.

I try keep it as light as possible, how much bravo one with transom assemblies and everything weight? I save three times that weight minus surface drives.

Docking isn't problem, jet pump driven thrusters would do the job. If I broke prop, it can be removed in water. If anything else broke, it's towing time... Boat live most time on small lakes, so interruption isn't catastrophical. I have think about chrash boxes and twin 72c after crossbox, maybe later, I try first consept as simple as possible.



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Old 01-26-2020, 01:34 PM
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If it has closed cooling that will help a lot with temperature consistency just make sure it is big enough for the power you want not the stock power. Closed cooling for that power will weigh hundreds of pounds. Make sure the engine has a big circulation pump that is independent of the main water pump/thermostat control that will always be circulating coolant in the engine.

what is the part number on the transmission? Most of the one or two speed for that power weigh 600-1500 lbs.

A bow thruster will make using it as a single a lot easier. And if your not going a long ways offshore then the breakdown would not be as big of a problem.

not sure if your splitter box has cooling? But it will need either water cooling the case or cool the oil.

what drives are you going to run?

be sure to use a good fuel filter system that is rated for a lot more then you think because we usually get dirtier diesel then the trucks and can burn/filter a lot more in a short amount of time because of the constant load and high rpm.



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Old 01-26-2020, 02:41 PM
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Yes, closed cooling and full flow all time, three way thermostat. for worse closed cooling add weight, but it worth of it. engine have BIG circulating pump, run 1.5 times than engine rpm, but piping is too small. I modify that and rotate circuit upside down. cold water comes from distribution manifold to heads, between each exhaust ports, hot water come out 6 points, lower side of liners. that way every cylinder have constant, high water flow. I made this way my rally car, S54 head conversion BMW with electric water pump. It works fine.


Transmission is ZF 5HP600, used in coach and trucks in Europe, very strong automatic planetary transmission, easy to modify. I take converter off and use it like velvet 72c. who else have two differrent ratio reverse gears? I mean it's easy try different ratios just turning switch. https://www.zf.com/products/en/speci...cts_29085.html









bow and stern thuster is must. They will be very light weight hydraulic driven jet pump types (homemade).

I will put temp gauges everywhere, add crossbox cooling if nesessery. It's straight cut gear module 5 gears, aluminium case, roller bearings, quite good efficiency so it doesen't heat much. Hydraulic power loss (lubricant) make heat, dry sump would be best choice, but like I say, keep all simple as possible first.

Drives use ASD8 propshafts, but they are reinvented and more simple, I post pics some day, difficult to explain in a foreign language. I planned it myself, machining have done my friend because my lathe is too small. Material is 304 and 306. I'm looking for arneson style trim cylinders but not find yet, maybe I need machine those too from scratch. What you think U joints, are 1350 series ok or better go 1410. Easier find parts to 1350 series...

I have such big port filter housing from some volvo engine, water separator/raw filter and big fine filter. I can use twin bosch 044 pumps, maybe quad. two running normal, four when driving hard. Too much flow can heat fuel. Fuel transfer is easy to solve

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Old 01-26-2020, 05:53 PM
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I did a little math and you will definitely need to fill the notch in to carry the weight. I would bet your engine-drivetrain will weigh 5,800 lbs +or- 200 lbs

That will be at least 2,000 lbs heavier then the original triple 525-drivetrain system.

I would strongly suggest that you may want to rethink the transmission. I know you said heavily modified but it was only designed to handle 1,400 nm you said you are trying to make 7000-8000 nm, it cannot be modified to Handle that much more. the transmission weighs a lot and is really long which will move that really heavy engine forward which will make the boat handle different.

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Old 01-26-2020, 06:19 PM
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That transmission has almost 5-1 gear reduction in reverse. The props will have less then half thrust in reverse compared to forward so you will have to be on the rev limiter to get it to back up. My two speed transmissions are almost 3-1 in reverse and it barely moves and has to be reved up to back up.

Not trying to rain on your parade. Just trying to give opinions/ideas that you can check on and then make a decision on what you want to do.

It’s your boat and you can do what ever you want but there are a lot of people on here that have done a lot of stuff so I would at least think about anything someone says to see if it’s relevant to your project.
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Old 01-26-2020, 10:52 PM
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Dressed engine 2000lbs
transmission 330lbs
crossbox 300lbs
drives are lighter thän arnesons, because they are way different. Maybe 110lbs/piece
It's 2830lbs total, maybe 3000, every little part have mass so something get out of calculations. I quarantee that I'm not so much off reality.

Transmission internals are way stronger than torque classification. converter and turbineshaft are weakest points. I don't need turbine and because that shaft could redone bigger and without turbine lock oil passange that impair original shaft.
I have rebuild coulpe of tens these transmissions and never seen any broken gear parts. five satellite planetaries and about 13" clutch plates, high hydraulic pressure are very good point to start. Converter multiply torque to 6 times when vehicle go from stop to move. 10.000Nm is now input torque....
ecomat 4 have same internals than ecomat 1...
  • 5HP504/C - five speed for lighter buses up to 13 ton; maximum input torque of 850 newton metres (627 lbf⋅ft)
  • 5HP504/C / 6HP504/C — five- or six-speed; maximum input torque of 1,100 newton metres (811 lbf⋅ft)
  • 5HP594/C / 6HP594/C — five- or six-speed; maximum input torque of 1,250 newton metres (922 lbf⋅ft)
  • 5HP604/C / 6HP604/C — five- or six-speed; maximum input torque of 1,750 newton metres (1,291 lbf⋅ft)
I don't use stock reveerse ratio. activated clutch are reverse (C clutch) and 1. (F), I will use C and E so ratio is about 2.5:1. In vehicles that gear is never used, but it exist there already.

Bigsilvercat, I do not disappointed your talk. its fantastic that somebody who have tried to do things take a stand and tell opinions, thanks about that.


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