I LOVE this GD boat!
07-25-2006, 08:27 AM
#61
Registered User
Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
Welcome to the world of performance boating.
Why is insurance so high?
Speeds have grossly outpaced operator experience and ability- you notice how many deaths and injuries there are these days with step-boat rollovers, etc. Plus you still have this pervasive attitude that boozing and boating are a match made in heaven. It doesn't help that all SOME manufacturers can talk about is speed records. It used to be that offshore was just that- offshore. Now you have 100+ mph boats on crowded inland lakes sharing the water with fishermen, jet-skis and sailboaters. No wonder no one wants to take that on. I sure wouldn't.
And guess what- you get to pay for it.
If insuring go-fast boats was anything near a lucrative proposition you'd have major insurers stepping into the market. The one's that will wriet, only skim the cream- no older boats, no fast boats.
I'm sorry to read your post. You started with the excitement of a new father. I hope it works out for you.
Why is insurance so high?
Speeds have grossly outpaced operator experience and ability- you notice how many deaths and injuries there are these days with step-boat rollovers, etc. Plus you still have this pervasive attitude that boozing and boating are a match made in heaven. It doesn't help that all SOME manufacturers can talk about is speed records. It used to be that offshore was just that- offshore. Now you have 100+ mph boats on crowded inland lakes sharing the water with fishermen, jet-skis and sailboaters. No wonder no one wants to take that on. I sure wouldn't.
And guess what- you get to pay for it.
If insuring go-fast boats was anything near a lucrative proposition you'd have major insurers stepping into the market. The one's that will wriet, only skim the cream- no older boats, no fast boats.
I'm sorry to read your post. You started with the excitement of a new father. I hope it works out for you.
07-25-2006, 08:49 AM
#62
Geronimo36
Gold Member
Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
Originally Posted by Jayl13
The problem is if I take the crank pulley and move it to the blower and the blower pulley and move it to the crank it becomes 850 from the 600 they are detuned to now.
If I purchase a pulley for each crank I can bump the HP up and they are uncomfortable with this. What do you want me to tell you then? You can change this all day long if you want to.
Herb wont sign anything since he is not the last person that went through these engines. I dont know who is but Herb knows he is not the last one to touch them.
This is just a royal pain in the ass is what this is.
Like I said if its this much hassle to get a binder on the boat I cant imagine if I actually DID need them for a claim what they would want then, Oh you hit some submerged object, well we need the engines pulled out and dyno'ed, the cleats must be removed and inspected and the steering wheel dusted for prints so it assures them I was driving?
Im just very leery at this point that this company is worth it or not.
Ever get a gut feeling you are going to be royally shafted? I just have a feeling if I go through with this policy that is what is going to happen in the event I need them.
I can just see it now, If Im running along with Rick in his pantera and im in the apache, oh well you were racing so your not covered.
If I purchase a pulley for each crank I can bump the HP up and they are uncomfortable with this. What do you want me to tell you then? You can change this all day long if you want to.
Herb wont sign anything since he is not the last person that went through these engines. I dont know who is but Herb knows he is not the last one to touch them.
This is just a royal pain in the ass is what this is.
Like I said if its this much hassle to get a binder on the boat I cant imagine if I actually DID need them for a claim what they would want then, Oh you hit some submerged object, well we need the engines pulled out and dyno'ed, the cleats must be removed and inspected and the steering wheel dusted for prints so it assures them I was driving?
Im just very leery at this point that this company is worth it or not.
Ever get a gut feeling you are going to be royally shafted? I just have a feeling if I go through with this policy that is what is going to happen in the event I need them.
I can just see it now, If Im running along with Rick in his pantera and im in the apache, oh well you were racing so your not covered.
I changed pulleys to see if I could gain back some lost MPH from changing my drive setup and even though I added 1 lb more boost the motor ran a lot richer, I probably only made 25 hp more...
To do it properly I would need to re-jet the carbs...
07-25-2006, 11:24 AM
#63
Registered User
Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
There seems to be more than a few people in the insurance biz. Elton Porter is a good one. There's also a newby in the general boating section trying to sell insurance.
On speed, would they not accept a sea trial by a surveyor of their choosing? Also, there's no shortages of qualified opinions available on what that power will do in a full-cabin pleasure Apache. I'd start with McManus.
On speed, would they not accept a sea trial by a surveyor of their choosing? Also, there's no shortages of qualified opinions available on what that power will do in a full-cabin pleasure Apache. I'd start with McManus.
07-25-2006, 11:57 AM
#64
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Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
These insurance guys are nuts. An old Kramer race boat or a super light race layup like MM's might go 100mph with 850's. But a 41 with a cabin is probably around 85-88 mph depending on how large the cabin is. I don't think 1000 hp in a pleasure 41 would get it to 100 mph. There speed calculators are taking into account step bottoms is the only thing i can figure.
Our 41 5 pack race with Teague 900's went(and this hurts) 99.9 with full tanks a couple weeks ago. So maybe a few miles an hour more light on fuel. Our boat has no cabin and the front fuel tanks removed.
Somebody needs to explain the difference between a step bottomed Fountain and a 41 Apache wave crusher to this insurance company.
Keep trying Jason
Carl
Our 41 5 pack race with Teague 900's went(and this hurts
) 99.9 with full tanks a couple weeks ago. So maybe a few miles an hour more light on fuel. Our boat has no cabin and the front fuel tanks removed. Somebody needs to explain the difference between a step bottomed Fountain and a 41 Apache wave crusher to this insurance company.
Keep trying Jason
Carl
07-25-2006, 11:39 PM
#67
Registered
Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
[QUOTE=Jayl13]Guys its not the engines, Its the fact that I can change blower pulleys (if I put different set of pulleys on there I can get upwards to 1000 or more HP) if I change pulleys I can drop down to around 550-600 HP with some insane small pulleys. The ease of bumping the HP mark way high or way low is what they have a problem with. They wanted me to pull the engines out and dyno them on my dime. Im like are you nuts? Im not pulling engines that run great out of the boat cause YOU have a problem with 600 HP or whatever. They came snooping on here OSO looking for my boat and the power and speeds and any other information they could get on the boat and I have a list of things I have to fix before they will bind my policy but the engines need to be squared away first.
I hate to say this but I am VERY bitter right now, Im more pissed at this whole thing than any of you could imagine. I have hated insurance companies since my dealing with them back when I turned 16 and the rage just grows and grows the more they jerk me around as I get older. Mark I realize I have to have it that is a no brainer. Problem is these guys are almost the only game in town so my hands are tied and they wont bind me until they have signed affidavit stating exactly what HP engines are and they have their magical phantom speed to HP calculator and with 850's they are saying the boat is well into the 100 MPH range which is going to bump my premium up 35%.
You all know this, How many damn 41 apaches are over 100 that are pleasure versions?
Come on now, And with 3 blade props slipping 27% puh leze but they have their calculator that knows every facet of boating and can easily say my boat is good for 108-110
Yeah, My GPS has not even shown me 80 yet.
So I dont know what the F im going to do, I might just sell this thing and just forget about boating for a while until these moron insurance companies decide to write marine policy's in the state with the most registered boats in the continential United States.
As it was, If a named storm comes along they will NOT cover any damages from the minute a hurricane warning is put into place until its lifted so 80% of the reasons for a claim down here are all on me and they wont cover anything as it is.
Nice way to get out of your responsibility.
Maybe we should all open our own insurance companies and we can put rules into play like homeowners, we will cover you 100% except for the following issues
Fire
theft,
Storm damage
water damage
termites
lightning
trees falling on it
kids in the neighborhood throwing rocks etc
driving your car through your garage door
earth quakes
mudslides
snow
rain
wind
any damage other than these things only limited to 27.50$ anything over 28 bucks in damage you are responsible for.
Okay your premium is 8500 a year due in advance and if not ill send Vinny to come and break your legs (which also is not covered) and if someone slips and falls on your property you are liable cause you must have screwed something up.
Insurance companies play the laws of averages and sometimes their actuary's are wrong and they take a hit, Dont mind making billions for years and years when there were no storms down here to really speak of, but have 2 crummy years in a row and they all bail out of the state and shaft everyone of their customers cause they dont want to loose money.
Or they come up with this bullcrap way of shedding their responsibility so they dont have to pay.
Needless to say im looking elsewhere for insurance since I can not believe insurance underwriters would come on to OSO and start snooping for specs on my boat and things of that sort.
And if you are reading this Mr Insurance underwriter, Why dont you come up with an insurance program for us that are and always will be responsible boaters with decent equipment that would never put a claim in unless necessary and we really need some peace of mind that you Actually will be there for us not waiting in the bushes to yank our shorts down and take a pic and run and shaft us.
If you are having me jump through this many hoops just to GET a policy I cant imagine dealing with you people If I actually needed help and had to put a claim in.
Are you going to give me the 9000 question quiz if I put a claim in? Are you going to deny me if I have a legitimate claim but since the dash board of my boat is pink is that reason to deny me?
I have 3 bilge pumps on the boat and the float switch on the pump in the cabin is broken so I need to replace it, Take pics of it and send it to you with a description of what I did and how I repaird it.
Does this sound NORMAL to you guys?
Yes im going to replace the whole bilge pump thats all fine well and good and im going to do that for ME not for the insurance company. But are you going to come and inspect my boat every 3 months and tell me my policy is on hold until I paint the deck or remove the screw under the seat cause its worn or whatever.
Where do you guys stop?
Okay im done venting now.
damn homey i'm sorry for all this chit that is happening to you ...but keep trying to find a way ...but selling the boat is way out of the questioned
mike
I hate to say this but I am VERY bitter right now, Im more pissed at this whole thing than any of you could imagine. I have hated insurance companies since my dealing with them back when I turned 16 and the rage just grows and grows the more they jerk me around as I get older. Mark I realize I have to have it that is a no brainer. Problem is these guys are almost the only game in town so my hands are tied and they wont bind me until they have signed affidavit stating exactly what HP engines are and they have their magical phantom speed to HP calculator and with 850's they are saying the boat is well into the 100 MPH range which is going to bump my premium up 35%.
You all know this, How many damn 41 apaches are over 100 that are pleasure versions?
Come on now, And with 3 blade props slipping 27% puh leze but they have their calculator that knows every facet of boating and can easily say my boat is good for 108-110
Yeah, My GPS has not even shown me 80 yet.
So I dont know what the F im going to do, I might just sell this thing and just forget about boating for a while until these moron insurance companies decide to write marine policy's in the state with the most registered boats in the continential United States.
As it was, If a named storm comes along they will NOT cover any damages from the minute a hurricane warning is put into place until its lifted so 80% of the reasons for a claim down here are all on me and they wont cover anything as it is.
Nice way to get out of your responsibility.
Maybe we should all open our own insurance companies and we can put rules into play like homeowners, we will cover you 100% except for the following issues
Fire
theft,
Storm damage
water damage
termites
lightning
trees falling on it
kids in the neighborhood throwing rocks etc
driving your car through your garage door
earth quakes
mudslides
snow
rain
wind
any damage other than these things only limited to 27.50$ anything over 28 bucks in damage you are responsible for.
Okay your premium is 8500 a year due in advance and if not ill send Vinny to come and break your legs (which also is not covered) and if someone slips and falls on your property you are liable cause you must have screwed something up.
Insurance companies play the laws of averages and sometimes their actuary's are wrong and they take a hit, Dont mind making billions for years and years when there were no storms down here to really speak of, but have 2 crummy years in a row and they all bail out of the state and shaft everyone of their customers cause they dont want to loose money.
Or they come up with this bullcrap way of shedding their responsibility so they dont have to pay.
Needless to say im looking elsewhere for insurance since I can not believe insurance underwriters would come on to OSO and start snooping for specs on my boat and things of that sort.
And if you are reading this Mr Insurance underwriter, Why dont you come up with an insurance program for us that are and always will be responsible boaters with decent equipment that would never put a claim in unless necessary and we really need some peace of mind that you Actually will be there for us not waiting in the bushes to yank our shorts down and take a pic and run and shaft us.
If you are having me jump through this many hoops just to GET a policy I cant imagine dealing with you people If I actually needed help and had to put a claim in.
Are you going to give me the 9000 question quiz if I put a claim in? Are you going to deny me if I have a legitimate claim but since the dash board of my boat is pink is that reason to deny me?
I have 3 bilge pumps on the boat and the float switch on the pump in the cabin is broken so I need to replace it, Take pics of it and send it to you with a description of what I did and how I repaird it.
Does this sound NORMAL to you guys?
Yes im going to replace the whole bilge pump thats all fine well and good and im going to do that for ME not for the insurance company. But are you going to come and inspect my boat every 3 months and tell me my policy is on hold until I paint the deck or remove the screw under the seat cause its worn or whatever.
Where do you guys stop?
Okay im done venting now.
damn homey i'm sorry for all this chit that is happening to you ...but keep trying to find a way ...but selling the boat is way out of the questioned
mike
07-26-2006, 07:11 AM
#68
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Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
Ill just keep hammering on this until I come up with a viable solution to the problem Have no choice really.
I just cringe at the fact if I did get this policy ironed out, If I needed them (with an insurance company when you think about it you NEED them to have your back this stuff is too expensive if someone hits you or something bad happens)
You need that complete assurance in your mind they are there for you, Like allstate says are you in good hands? That actually means alot, Knowing your agent is cool with your rig and has your back when you need him/her.
I dont think I am going to continue with this guy since I feel uncomfortable from that point. If something bad were to happen god forbid, would they come out and start inspecting blower pulleys and bilge pumps and fuel lines and docking lights, checking my MSD boxes, sea strainers and the like? No I want someone that can simpathize with my problem and try to HELP me not try to get out of paying a claim that I might have or try to avoid helping me in other ways cause I have a choice of blower pulleys.
If they dont have your back, whats the point right?
I have a place that quoted me 3900 but Ill call that other place today that Donzi33 posted up and see if that is an option for me.
Chris, I agree with everything that you said but honestly I hate to say this I think its time for drivers licenses for boats and mandatory boating courses like driving a car for the water. Okay I dont need a full blown captains license like im piloting a 60+ footer but something applicable to what I have and so on.
Im sure I dont have the most experience in the world when it comes to driving high performance boats but I can fend for myself there and I dont do stupid things for myself, I have alot to loose.
I thought I might have a problem docking this thing since everyone told me its a staggered you will have to get used to maneuvering it in tight areas and around other boats it will be really tough. I think that part of this I have handled (Ask The Donz, I can fit this thing in a Tuna can if I wanted to) and I am getting very comfortable behind the wheel. Too bad its sort of on hold at the moment with this insurance stuff.
Ill get it ironed out just might take some time that I had not planned on.
If not Ill move from FL back up to Michigan or somewhere like that and insurance will cost me about 700 bucks a year.
I just cringe at the fact if I did get this policy ironed out, If I needed them (with an insurance company when you think about it you NEED them to have your back this stuff is too expensive if someone hits you or something bad happens)
You need that complete assurance in your mind they are there for you, Like allstate says are you in good hands? That actually means alot, Knowing your agent is cool with your rig and has your back when you need him/her.
I dont think I am going to continue with this guy since I feel uncomfortable from that point. If something bad were to happen god forbid, would they come out and start inspecting blower pulleys and bilge pumps and fuel lines and docking lights, checking my MSD boxes, sea strainers and the like? No I want someone that can simpathize with my problem and try to HELP me not try to get out of paying a claim that I might have or try to avoid helping me in other ways cause I have a choice of blower pulleys.
If they dont have your back, whats the point right?
I have a place that quoted me 3900 but Ill call that other place today that Donzi33 posted up and see if that is an option for me.
Chris, I agree with everything that you said but honestly I hate to say this I think its time for drivers licenses for boats and mandatory boating courses like driving a car for the water. Okay I dont need a full blown captains license like im piloting a 60+ footer but something applicable to what I have and so on.
Im sure I dont have the most experience in the world when it comes to driving high performance boats but I can fend for myself there and I dont do stupid things for myself, I have alot to loose.
I thought I might have a problem docking this thing since everyone told me its a staggered you will have to get used to maneuvering it in tight areas and around other boats it will be really tough. I think that part of this I have handled (Ask The Donz, I can fit this thing in a Tuna can if I wanted to) and I am getting very comfortable behind the wheel. Too bad its sort of on hold at the moment with this insurance stuff.
Ill get it ironed out just might take some time that I had not planned on.
If not Ill move from FL back up to Michigan or somewhere like that and insurance will cost me about 700 bucks a year.
07-26-2006, 08:07 AM
#69
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Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
The other thing I'm sure is affecting insurance rates in Fla is all the darn Hurricanes.
Keep trying Jason, you'll find some reasonable insurance. Best of luck.
Regards
Carl.
Keep trying Jason, you'll find some reasonable insurance. Best of luck.
Regards
Carl.
07-26-2006, 08:13 AM
#70
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Re: I LOVE this GD boat!
Carl, Most of the insurance companies pulled out of the state because of the hurricanes, so out of the XXX number of companies you could call 2 years ago now there are only a handful of places that will write down here and most of them if a storm comes along pat you on your back and say you are on your own. If a storm with a name comes along (meaning tropical depression or above) then dont bother calling the insurance company cause they will refuse any claim completely so dont even bother. So okay if I can get a policy that wont cover any sort of storm damage, why the HELL would you want to charge me 200+% more than anywhere else in the country when the biggest "factor" of a loss would be a storm and you have in BIG BOLD LETTERS NO STORM COVERAGE< NO WIND DAMAGE Nothing.
Nice huh?
Rape you and will refuse to cover you anyway!
Why I dont understand
Nice huh?
Rape you and will refuse to cover you anyway!
Why I dont understand
