I will pass this information on to Bob Seccenti.
And maybe he can tell you who built the boats when the Feds took it over.

You might be one.

[/QUOTE]Not Me

this is about to get really good!

What in the hell has happened to this douzy of thread. So now Big john is claiming that the feds actually built the boats when kramers assets were seized?

From a business perspective I would think that they would keep the "star employee" around to run things with hopes of selling Apache as an operating business rather than materials and half finished boats.

I was under the impression that the star employee built the boats 41' and over and Bobby continued to build his 36's and 28's and then one day in 2004 he found out that the star employee had purchased the trademark for peanunts out from under his nose.

I'm just a dumb kid and correct me if my interpretation is incorrect. I would definately take the word of Chris over John. John just started posting two weeks ago and Chris has proven his knowledge of the brand for years.

Now I'm confursed. I thought that the feds owned Apache during the late 80's through the early 90's, with B Saccenti running operations.

My hull ID starts with APH. When did the feds own apache, specifically what build years?

the real question......apache performance boats or apache powerboats......what is the differance........who has which...

hmmmm
 

"whats in a name, really" :evilb:

one is a performance boat, one is a powerboat.
and you have one, and i dont. :D

one was confisgated and one wasn't........

HINT.............

Thanks, I really thought there was another company building them for a while. So Commanchie was just a new name for the same Co.? You now more than me thanks for the info.

All these OSO members that claim to know so much and I have yet to get a straight answer:(

28 apache perf boat.........became a 28 cherokee......comanche is differant tribe.......

I'm sorry Cherokee is the name I was trying to remember. Thanks for clearing that one up, thats why I ask you, you have the correct info and I want it right :D

I always was under the assumption that Eric was building the Commanche :party-smiley-004:

Without re-hashing all that is here in the Apache section already...

Ben & Bobby parted ways before Ben got hooked. Apache's assets were seized by Federal authorities and a receiver was appointed- almost identically to what happens in a bankruptcy. But in this case, since Ben was in jail, his production manager, Mark McManus continued operating the company just as it was. The Feds wanted to extract some value from the place and it was a viable, ongoing, profotable business with employees. McManus eventually purchased the operations from the Feds. Never did the Federal government operate Apache or build boats.

There's alot more nonsense that goes along with Apache history. Start at the first post in this forum and read them all. You'll know at least half of the story anyway.

Comanche is a McManus brand

apache, comanche.......who cares.....dont put no porkchops on my plate.....how about yours?.......see any porkchops......just a reality check..........mark...

if you want info about apache boats
just call Bob Seccenti. I am sure he knows more about apaches than anyone on here.

No, Big John never actullay said the Feds built boats. So read what was said if you can.


Yea theres alot of dumb kids on here, I wouldnt take anybodies word on here. I think Bob Seccenti knows more about Apache's than Chris and you. So believe what you want to believe.

This is just a bunch BS.

Post 115 0f this thread-

Talking about yourself in the 3rd person? OK, "Big John".

Darned dumb kids. They neeeed to get a gummd edamakatin or sumpin. I pittttty da Foo dat kant read what I sed.

I'll do a little cut and paste action of an old quote that sums things up pretty well IMO:

A quick summary for you is this quote from Bob Saccenti himself (I actually have copy of it I keep in my 36' because people always have questions and it is easier to hand them this)

"I founded Apache Powerboats in 1978 when I started tooling my 21’, 33’ & 39’ boat line. I incorporated Apache Powerboats and went into production in 1980. At the same time I also owned and operated Race Headquarters, Inc., a custom Hi-Performance center and I also co-owned Hawk Marine Power.

In 1982, I brought the Kramer’s into Apache as my partners, sold my interest in Hawk Marine Power and absorbed Race Headquarters, its crew and all its equipment into Apache. The first order of business was to produce the baddest wave buster’s money could buy. Since the tooling for my new 39’ offshore was still months away from completion, I went to the King himself, Don Aronow, and made arrangements to purchase a new 41’ mold he had just completed. The first boat out of the mold was blue and tan and Benny called it “Warpath”. My original Race Headquarters crew rigged Warpath and off we went for sea trial. Ben and I ran Warpath offshore through some of the heaviest seas imaginable at over 90 miles per hour. Ben and I knew immediately that we had built a real winner. We entered Warpath in the APBA Open Class and won the Key West World Championship in 1984. The original factory team was Ben Kramer – Driver, Bob Saccenti – Throttles, and Tom Evans – Navigator. In 1985 we took Second in the Key West U.I.M. Worlds, with the red “Team Apache”.

Ben and I were now racing around the world with APBA & U.I.M. to promote Apache Powerboats. Because of our demanding race schedule we decided to contract Bobby Moore to rig all of our 41’ production and to serve as Crew Chief on our race team. In 1985, I ended my partnership with the Kramer’s on a friendly note agreeing to share the name Apache. I called my company Apache Performance Boats; he kept my original name, Apache Powerboats. Even though we were now two separate companies, we continued to act as one, sharing boat show space and tooling. We also continued to race as a team for promotion of the name. In 1986, we won the National Championship and were awarded the coveted US1 in our “prototype” catamaran “Team Apache”. That was also the year we introduced the new 47’ triple engine Apache Superboat.

In 1987, things started to fall apart. The Kramer’s had major legal problems and the government seized all their assets including Fort Apache Marina and Apache Powerboats. The government hand picked one of Ben’s employees to run the company while they completed their investigation. Some of Ben’s employees were involved with Ben’s problems, some left, and new people were hired. With the new star employee running things, the first order of his business was to disassemble the last 41’ Bobby Moore rigged and copy all measurements and systems and make jigs and templates to duplicate Bobby Moore’s genius (nothing like knowing your trade). Bobby Moore has never gotten over this to this day.

Many years passed and it was business as usual for me. Around 1996, the government auctioned all the Kramer’s assets. The only thing they did not sell was the Florida Trademark for Apache and the Apache Powerboat name. I did not think about it at the time because my Apache Trademark, although slightly different, is a Federal Trademark. From time to time my attorney in Washington would inquire about the State trademark and was always told “it’s not for sale”. Well, SURPRISE – SURPRISE. After one such inquiry, I was advised that the same STAR EMPLOYEE had just purchased the Florida Trademark from the same “it’s not for sale” government for a couple hundred bucks. What a success story, the employee gets to own the company. talk about back dooring. It must be nice to have close buddy's in the right places.

Now the real confusion.

With Apache Powerboats & Apache Performance Boats already sharing the market, the old retired 41’ molds were purchased at auction for 12k and re-sold to a company in Ohio that advertised that they could build the “41’ Apache for half the price”. Also, the star employee moved to the other coast and started to produce boats by Xerox under another tribal name and when I wasn’t looking he slid a few Apache’s in for good measure. Personally, I think he should have named his company “High Dollar Lead Sleds, Inc.”. Additionally, in the early – mid 90’s, a Miami based company made a very, very bad copy of the 41’. They changed the bottom, cut the sheer, and the first time in the water the boat rolled in its first turn. The molds were stacked and stored in the sun and weather out in the yard to never be used again. Just recently those same molds were sold to an individual in Blountstown, Florida who is now saying he is the “New Apache”. What a joke. I wouldn’t use those molds for a flower pot.

All of this would have surely brought tears to Geronimo’s eyes.

Also, rumor has it that I sold out, died, left town, closed up and went out of business and so on. WRONG. NONE OF THE ABOVE

All that I have written here can easily be verified and I know, I lived it.

If you have any questions please call or fax me. I do better on the phone than the keyboard. The resin makes my fingers stick to the keys.

Also, thanks to all the Apache owners who put the TLC and money into keeping their Apache in tip top shape and promoting the heritage.

Best regards,

Bob Saccenti"

Thanks baywatch I knew that was in there somewhere, but being the computer moron I am I couldn't find it.

Sorry after rereading this -- it was cherokee that I was under that assumption. I'll not post anymore and just read and learn!

As far as John John he should probably take that advice also. Bob's name is spelled Saccenti, ---he's a very nice and extremely knowledgeable person.

All of us Dumb kids got to stick together. One Tribe, one passion!!

You said the Feds and the US Marshalls did.

Only your friend Chris Sunkia said that, not me.

That is where I got my information from, Bob.

That is where I get my advice from Bob SAccenti.

He is the best boat builder.

And very very nice guy.

I hope its spelled right this time, just for you to read. DELSOL

"RIGHT ON"................

Nice Boat

Tell Bob I Said Hey

I dont really think it matters when you start to post on OSO. I think it matters who you get your information from.

Did the boat sell?? I see its gone from the classifieds.

Did this boat ever sell?

Nobody knows if this boat ever sold?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Apach...QQcmdZViewItem Poped up on ebay today. Ad says fuel tank is 200 gallons. I thought it was closer to 125 or 150. Now I'm curious.........what is the tank size on a 28?

I will give him 20,000 grand for it, I can use it for parts:D. I think I will bid on it.

Hey it is over 20,000 already, I cant wait to see what it sell's for????? Andy the Tank size for our boat is 120 gallons!!!

Hey I'll give you a little more for yours, how about 25,000 and you can keep the trailer



Dont bother bidding cause your not gonna buy it.

Hey, Bud thanks for the E-mail, good luck on selling the boat, why be so negative? I E-mailed the link to several friend looking for a 28 Apache????? Thanks for the nice E-mail about OSO members!!!!! I wouldnt worry about what I can buy!!!, if I wanted your boat I would buy it!

FirstName: John
LastName: S
Phone: 4043911174
Email: [email protected]
Country: United States
Service: Other
Comments: I see that you still like talking about someone else boat. I hope you are not the owner of this place, because if you were i would think you would have something else to do. You do not want to buy the boat so why dont you just keep your comments to yourself. And let grown men bid on this boat, since you still act like a child, just like the rest of you on OSO. You sound like gossipy middle school girls.

I HOPE SOMEONE ELSE OWNS THIS BUSINESS, THAT HAS THEIR PRIORTIES STRAIGHT.
Submit: Submit
REMOTE_ADDR: 68.114.45.212
HTTP_USER_AGENT: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)
DATE: 22:5:34 2008-4-28

Ok Mr. Know it all, read what you post, you dont even know what size the tank is. It depends on who built the boat and what size they wanted. So again, I guess theres a few on OSO they dont have nothing else to do but to gossip about someone else's boat. I guess yall havent learned yet,