It is a verbal confidientiality agreement, even though I got boned by them, im bound not to say anything revealing about their business interactions ect.

Sucks yes
but has to be that way.

As for the T4, that is just sitting there upside down untouched.
Yesterday they were welding the tubular frame around the conventional V bottom
as far as when they are going to polish it and start laying glass is unknown by me.
I think part of the problem here is that there are alot of variables involved that no one anticipated prior to the company starting up again
How many people lay claim to the name apache
Thad
Bobby
Mark
Todd (guy from hawk power) Cimmino or whatever his name is
and god only knows who else if anyone.

then you have the sets of molds that are floating around.
Sabre
thad
Chief (think they have one of the original 47 molds if im not mistaken??????)
and im sure there are other molds scattered around floating somewhere.

with all of this and all the nightmare press and aggervation the company has taken, i dont know what plan B means but I can say this
if he cant put the name apache on that boat his profits are not going to be as high which i think is whaat he was banking on to begin with.


Factor this into the game as well
Was or IS it the name APACHE that people are following or is it BOBBY?
funny how almost every apache owner out there instntly changed their avitar pic to the chief powerboats avitar upon the announcement of chief powerboats what 1-2 weeks after the miami show?
DIE HARD apache guys changed their avitar and did not even skip a beat.
take that and ask yourself APACHE WHATS IN A NAME?
well the name commands respect of course, they set milestones in the industry
but WHO dictated those milestones/????
That all points back to Bobby not the name.

Hell I or any of you can jump right over to Sabre's website and get an original 41 and you KNOW EXACTLY what the hell it is. Most of us would be PROUD to own one of the 41 sabres too, cause we KNOW what it really is!!!

I dont know what is PLAN B is and i can only offer my observation and not any insider information cause i really dont have too much but in my best guess if he cant put "apache" or "warpath' on the side of those boats, he is going to get hurt moneywise.

Similar situation is that "lightning" in the classifieds on this site,
we know what it is, it looks like a guided missle too, i personally lOVe that boat but honestly do you think it will bring the price tag it has on it? It is a custom one off no one ever heard of it before no name brand.
only one in existance.
still a 41 but who built it? where and which mold did it come from?

Not only are you looking for "the name' and or whats in a name your also looking at WHO IS BUILDING THE BOAT
steve1 hands down created something to be marveled at.
if you saw the work this guy did on these plugs and the T4 you would probbly have ice tea leg!!
but would you want it if it had Glasstron or bayliner written down the side of it?

These are all factors invovled, if they cant put apache on the thing, even though it is more technologically advanced more than 99% of the boats out there in how it will be constructed and was fabricated and lovingly sanded by hand by Steve1 for MONThs AND MONTHS checked 90 billion times with straight edges and everything else, will it be worth what they are asking?

things for sale are only worth what a buyer is willing to pay for it.

so each individual has to determine, is XXX amount worth it to me to purchase this yes or no?
Do i believe in the company to stand behind the product or do i feel im going to be boned?
this was a part of MY JOB there , to talk to people, to get them to understand that we would stand behind the product, that it would be solid, if it ws not, hell ill take my own dually come pick it up, bring it back here, get it fixed to owners satisfaction or beyond to gurantee a high level of customer satisfaction and to believe in the apache name again.

Too bad im now a manager of IT infrastructure at a custom home builder in Pompano/Ft Lauderdale area.

Craig, as much as i would love to tell you more, i dont know too much since my lay off back in Late Feb.
i still like billy, Richard, tim and have nothing bad to say bout those guys.
I think Thad could have been more professional and discussed this lay off with me rather than have Billy do it.
I hve not talked to thad since my lay off either.
but from what I read in the news paper, he has more than his hands full.
its a shame when you look at it though, he is so close to getting things moving on a more full steam basis and now this comes up and sort of wedges a knife in the side right as full on production is just about able to start.

Jason

PS anyone who gets laid off is bitter at their company, its human nature to be pissed off at that.
but you know what, Im in a very stable company now, I have a great job, working with really good computer technology, cadd stuff everything from architects to mortgage people, everything.
So I am not as bitter as i was cause im making alot more money than i was at Apache and more stability
So maybe this was a good thing (im looking at it as that)
would have been an amazing adventure to work at apache but i guess it was not in the cards

J

This is all a bunch of horse**** .... somebody kill this thread.

:rolleyes:

One question remains in my head though that someone might be able to shed some light on here.

Does Mark OWN any of the molds for the boats?
or does he just have the questionable rights to the name apache?
The article states that Mark has been "building and refurbishing apaches for the last 4 years"
Anyone know the answer to this?

Thanks guys,
Jason

Hi Mike you have Broadband Internet and a Quick time viewer ??

Jay Carl or one of the guys can answer that.

From what I remember there were 2 companies.

Apache Powerboats, Inc. ( I think this one was Kramer's)

and

Apache Performance Boats, Inc. (Saccenti's)

I might have it back wards, but this is what I remember.

I personally feel it doesn't matter what name Thad has on his boats, they will not sell period. I'm sure Steve1 made a good boat, but Thad's PR abilities ruined any chance of him becoming successful in the boat business.

It sure looks like Thad will be the sole owner of Delray's finest 3 million dollar boat.

3

Moment of Truth,

I do not know who you are, but you are in the wrong place buddy if you think you can post false accusations about Mr. Saccenti here. Take your **** somewhere else. What's the big Moment of truth?? huh the judges ruling this month????

What documents?

I find it a little difficult to believe that Mr. Allen bought a trademark from someone for 1/2 a million bucks without checking it out first.

Also if I remember correctly Bobby dine't take the money & run. He & Eric stayed on with Thad until they were asked to leave, MONTHS LATER... If they knowingly defrauded Thad, Why did they stay?


Moment of Bull****,

I'm not as clueless as you will think, and have a pretty good idea who you are..

Let it go..., boats aren't for you Go back to Chicago!!


Also Wouldn't it be possible that there were 2 Apache companies that I stated above????

Well it would stand to reason that if Bobby sold Thad the name that didnt belong to him he might as well stick around to see what other stuff this guy would buy!!!!!

Hey Thad I own the Nike Swoosh, interested????

Please don't shoot me Mr Allen...

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Wrong Kitty I was there Eric got let go the first couple days into it.

Then Bob left..

:p :p :p

Kitty tell the story on the Picture..

It's fair to say that they didn't run Steve.

Good night guys

Nite Kitty..

Steve,

You gotta admit it's a good picture.

Looks like a crazed crackhead!!!

Oh my god that picture is a KEEPER!!!
LMFAO!

From my knowledge there were 2 companies, differentiated by size of boats built.
28-36 was one
the the 41-47 and cat was the other company.
both used apache name but different as mentioned by kitty.

But if Thad bought what bobby had in theory it is not what Mark has. They were 2 different companies making different products just had similar key word in company name AND were both the product of one company being split.

Moment of truth, your Thads brother right?
Chip ?
If so, how are you? Hope all is well with you.
Jason

It sure is easy to tell about who owns what trademarks via the internet and it seems some big shot with millions would have this info. Also were the two companies Apache performance boats and apache racing team?

Hey why not Apache high performance boats and a different logo and new stuff if their prduct is so much better. Why try to hang on to a reputation of a manufacturer you are going to criticize (ie:Resin bucket comment)

He bought (or so it was thought before all this came to light) the name, he can call it whatever he wants.

Not trying to defend the harsh insulting comment, but im just curious to see what happens with this court judgement.
I dont know why it would take so long, should be sort of cut and dry, either he bought it or he did not. What big decision is there really?
A judge has to rule on this, the paperwork should be able to define this answer with little effort dont you guys think?
J

Another Apatche thread gone down the crapper!!

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Is he the one that came online and was going to kick everyones ass? :rolleyes:

Actually I'm surprised this has remained fairly civilized up to this point... but you never know what that will change.:o

answer why allen called mcmanus to buy the rights.why would he spend all this money and not know what he bought?why would he create a web sight and advertise in a defensive way that he is the owner of apache-allen started to defend his position before there was any public knowledge of the discrepancy.in the middle of litigation by allen,you advertise you are the new apache.the local news would not do an article without doing proper research,but a industry leading publication ,poker runs mag takes advertising dollars then prints an article without regard to the exacting truth.answer me this-why is allen after mcmanus?sounds to me like a little boy who did not get his way holds his breath and turns blue!my opinion.someone should think about finishing the so called boat doing all the testing it will take etc. etc.,then come up with another name and identity for the company and then go boating.stop trying to trash the apache name and mcmanus.grow up and realize there are some things in life that can not be bought.

MomentOfTruth

I have some thoughts. They run along the same lines as WetKitty42’s. “TAKE YOUR **** SOMEWHERE ELSE.” You haven’t got a clue.

I’m so tired of this **** and the “know it all’s”; you know so much? I DO. Does the name Warrior Powerboats, Inc. mean anything to you? It should if you knew anything about what your sticking your nose into. That’s what Thaddeus Allan purchased from me and Bob. PERIOD. END OF STORY.

Who the hell are you to make a statement like that?

Wow, I missed all the fun last night.


Moment of Truth has got to be Thad, Thad's brother, or one of Thads lawyers.

Alot of crap was said last night that is false.

1. Yes, Mark M owns molds. Yes, Mark has built boats after 96-97. How do I know? Well, I've seen them at the factory under construction. Any statements to the contrary are based on ignorance.

2. Theres nothing "Allegedly" about Mark McManus's ownership of the trademark. Mark McManus is an honest man, so stop trying to infer there were some shaddy dealings with the purchase of the trademark. Mark used first class intellectual property attorneys when he bought the trademark. This isn't divorce court, grow up.

3. WetKitty is right on the money(no pun intended) when he questions how can somebody spend 500k on something without doing proper(or even simple) due diligence. A quick trip over to the USPTO website would have shown that Mark McManus Inc was the owner of the trademark. I did it, it took a whole 3 minutes. Business moves fast, but not that fast. So Mark M gets sued because people don't know the basic rules of running a business.

4. If Thad owned the trademark, then why did he try to buy it from Mark McManus ???????? When Mark M did not want to sell it, this legal crap started.

Carl

3. WetKitty is right on the money(no pun intended) when she questions how can somebody spend 500k on something without doing proper(or even simple) due diligence.


What's with the she?

Names Wet Kitty, not wet *****:D :D

Man I'm gonna have to go back to Scalptaker after this comment......

I dont think it went down the crapper, we are discussing something that the palm beach post printed.
As far as tempers are concerned, thats because some people have money on the line with this stuff and I CERTAINLY wont say anything or get in the way of that stuff, im just specifically speaking about the article and facts.

I just want to see a boat already and I freakin worked there!!!
Jason

WetKitty
 

Opps, Sorry my bad. I won't let it happen again :)

NO no no , not Chip, Chip was the nicest friendliest guy.
He would give you the shirt off his back without even knowing you.
Very cool guy!

I dont know Thad's other brothers, never met them.
Jason

What I enjoy most about thread like these is that unfair or not, with every passing day of this crap, my CIGARETTE boat goes up in value!;)

It will be interesting to see what a judge has to say about all this.

One question though, if you bought a company (or just the name) Warrior Powerboats, Inc., why on earth would you call it "Apache"?

I seem to remember that Eric was there more that just the first couple of days...but what do I know I'm just the little wifey that doesn't know anything right?

But wasn't that Eric in the Apache booth at the Miami boat show in 2003 which was more that a few days after the whole deal went down, he was there until after we left which was in April 2003, please correct me if I am wrong Mr. Froberg ;)

Terra I believe the deal was done/made in March the show was back in February.. How are you doing up in the north-land?

Steve-

Thank you for responding and please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but the facts as I saw them were as follows.

1- Thad was already involved at the time of the boat show (the specific dates were February 13th-17th or something like that). He was there but no deal had been finalized.

2- In March the deal was complete, and it was Mr. Froberg who put the decals on the side of Mr. Allen's Formula, stating that his New Apache '41 was on order, before the Miami to Key West Poker Run that was March 15th and 16th.

3- Sean left Apache on the Saturday before Easter 2003 so I could go back to Texas to give birth to our baby. Mr. Froberg was still with the company.

Mr. Froberg left shortly there after. And as for Mr. Saccenti, he was there a significant amount of time longer.

My whole point is that Mr. Froberg was there more than just the first few days of Mr. Allen's "acquiring" the company. As for "taking the money and running", it didn't happen that way.

And as for north-land it is STILL FREAKIN COLD LOL. Hope all is well in sunny Florida

Respectfully
Terra

OK, so now we know that the POS that supposedly fell apart was a FORMULA!!!!!

I was guessing Fountain.

sorry you are right LOL. too much going through the brain right now.

(don't tell sean that I got a detail wrong he will never let me hear the end of it LMAO)

It was a Fountain

Here it is...

Now thats what I call a Moment of Truth.