new drive from IMCO
12-01-2011 | 09:02 PM
#151
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 323
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From: Cumming GA
You're about 20k off on your arneson price. Money wise they are close, but im sure I could sell my extension boxes imco transom assemblies and teague drives. Oh yeah but Id have to fill the notches.
It's right about 37K for two -4SCX with props, helmets, reservoirs, tie bar, through hulls and strainers. 60K with Arnesons and a boatload more work.
I'm seriously contemplating the -4's vs just a -2 but waiting for feedback on speed and planing ability.
With the Arnesons you have to pull the engines, add through hulls, change the helm and rams but I'm pretty sure you will pick up speed and reliability. I wish they could put a kit together that didn't require new trim and steering components. It could be a bit less expensive??? It also looks cool with the 6 props and roost.
The SCX-4's'll look cool too because they have the #6 props also. Unsure about roost.
It looks like the Arnesons will put the prop a couple inches higher than the SCX's and a bit further back because of the extention boxes. When's the Longshaft -6SCX coming out?
I'm seriously contemplating the -4's vs just a -2 but waiting for feedback on speed and planing ability.
With the Arnesons you have to pull the engines, add through hulls, change the helm and rams but I'm pretty sure you will pick up speed and reliability. I wish they could put a kit together that didn't require new trim and steering components. It could be a bit less expensive??? It also looks cool with the 6 props and roost.
The SCX-4's'll look cool too because they have the #6 props also. Unsure about roost.
It looks like the Arnesons will put the prop a couple inches higher than the SCX's and a bit further back because of the extention boxes. When's the Longshaft -6SCX coming out?
12-01-2011 | 09:59 PM
#152
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,613
Likes: 375
From: Traverse City MI
Arnesons are MAX 24k each side, including everything like tie bar, standoff box, new hydraulic steering, new transom assembly, new trim ram cylinders, etc.
MINUS the sale of your current unused parts
SCX4 + a standoff box, tie bar, heavy duty gimbal ring, helmet, resivoir, etc actually cost more than a Arneson.
only gain with the scx4 in my book is slightly easier install, but not much.
If you can install a scx4 you can install a arneson.
MINUS the sale of your current unused parts
SCX4 + a standoff box, tie bar, heavy duty gimbal ring, helmet, resivoir, etc actually cost more than a Arneson.
only gain with the scx4 in my book is slightly easier install, but not much.
If you can install a scx4 you can install a arneson.
12-01-2011 | 10:00 PM
#153
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 379
Likes: 1
From: Charlestown, IN
Still no info on the V bottom, twin set up!!! Good feedback on the single!!!! Nothing is perfect, butt, the new IMCO -4 sounds like it is a solid fix for the Bravo blues!!!! Time to call Dave @ IMCO!!!
12-02-2011 | 12:07 AM
#154
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 16
From: Renton, Wa
Rob, we have a few of the 38' Fountains in your same vintage with Arneson Surface Drives on them will great results.
Our #7M Kits are what we have for your application. These cost $23,125.00 each complete. The kits come with a one year warranty as you noted as there is little to go wrong with them none are breaking as soon as the one year mark is gone.
Your boat should see a 10 mph increase in mid range speed and close to 10 mph increase in top speed as well.
The #7M Kits include all the necessary components needed to install the #7M Kits onto the boat. All the mounting bolts, backing plates, studs, nuts washers, helm unit, motor mount, bell-housing, drive plate, hydraulic steering and trim cylinders, trim pump, standoff box and such are included in the kit.
What you will need are:
External water pickup
Thru Transom exhaust
Internal hydraulic hoses, and reservoir to connect your "power steering pumps" to the helm and back to the Arnesons.
Propellers
Indicator cables, indicators, trim switches
Note:
Your helm will not work with the Arneson steering cylinders and we include the correct helm unit for the Arnesons in the kit.
Your indicators will work with the Arneson. Your indicator cables might be long enough to work with the Arnesons also. We include the cable grip parts to hold the indicator cable to the cylinders.
The Arnesons have not water pumps, pickups nor exhaust system in them
The Arnesons use a Mercury #6 Speedmaster style propeller. Hering has an exchange program themselves for their customers. We can recommend a propeller that will be fairly close to what you are going to need for your application.
Where are you located?
As to why boat builders use Merc rather than Arneson, it comes down to a complete package that Mercury supplies to the boat builders as we do not have an engine package only an out-drive package. The boat builders have to source two separate items, engine and drive whereas with Mercury they get everything from one source. Mercury also has historically financed the purchase of their engine packages to the boat builders which Arneson does not do.
Please advise,
Rik Wimp
Arneson Industries
------------------------------------------------------------------
Seriously, I've looked into it.
Because I have Silent Choice, add new exhaust. What's that, $2K for a staggered set up? Process: make it in PVC, ship$ it (oversize probably$) to someone to make out of stainless and polish it and ship???it back. Install it and cuss because it doesn't fit and do it again.
"IF" my cables work. When has any boat mod ever "just worked"? Same with PS hoses and the helm/wheel.
Tie bar is needed on Arneson.
Tie bar needs to be shortened on SCX. Much cheaper
Transom PU's and strainers are the same
Props are the same
Labor:
Pull drives and helmets(already have IMCO rings), mount reservoir bottle and hook to existing line, install through hulls and strainers, install drives and fill.
VS
Pull engines, transom assemblies, helm, steering rams, cables?, hoses?, exhaust. Install through hulls, trans, drive, steering, etc. Now possibly have to glass the pad(I can't recall what Rik said, but I think so).
What'd I miss? Tons I'm sure but you get the basic idea
I can do all the labor but for someone that couldn't it's probably $5K more to install an Arneson.
Arneson $23125, exhaust $2K, through hull and misc. $2K times 2 = $54250+Props(6 Bl)=$65K+
SCX4 MSRP$15220, helmet FREE last month, reservoir 335, box not necessary, through hull and misc $500 times 2 = $32110+Props(5 Bl)=$40500+
I would absolutely LOVE to install the Arnesons. They're more efficient. They've been tried. They work. They HAVE a WARRANTY!!!!
SCX4 is more cost effective IF it works. -4 hasn't been tried on my boat. There is NO WARRANTY.
As for selling off old parts. How many old parts do we all have laying around that we "could" sell. Some are easy, like the drives and props, but the exhaust, steering, bell housings, couplers, etc have about a 1/4 to no value so we just keep them until forced to sell by the little woman.
Our #7M Kits are what we have for your application. These cost $23,125.00 each complete. The kits come with a one year warranty as you noted as there is little to go wrong with them none are breaking as soon as the one year mark is gone.
Your boat should see a 10 mph increase in mid range speed and close to 10 mph increase in top speed as well.
The #7M Kits include all the necessary components needed to install the #7M Kits onto the boat. All the mounting bolts, backing plates, studs, nuts washers, helm unit, motor mount, bell-housing, drive plate, hydraulic steering and trim cylinders, trim pump, standoff box and such are included in the kit.
What you will need are:
External water pickup
Thru Transom exhaust
Internal hydraulic hoses, and reservoir to connect your "power steering pumps" to the helm and back to the Arnesons.
Propellers
Indicator cables, indicators, trim switches
Note:
Your helm will not work with the Arneson steering cylinders and we include the correct helm unit for the Arnesons in the kit.
Your indicators will work with the Arneson. Your indicator cables might be long enough to work with the Arnesons also. We include the cable grip parts to hold the indicator cable to the cylinders.
The Arnesons have not water pumps, pickups nor exhaust system in them
The Arnesons use a Mercury #6 Speedmaster style propeller. Hering has an exchange program themselves for their customers. We can recommend a propeller that will be fairly close to what you are going to need for your application.
Where are you located?
As to why boat builders use Merc rather than Arneson, it comes down to a complete package that Mercury supplies to the boat builders as we do not have an engine package only an out-drive package. The boat builders have to source two separate items, engine and drive whereas with Mercury they get everything from one source. Mercury also has historically financed the purchase of their engine packages to the boat builders which Arneson does not do.
Please advise,
Rik Wimp
Arneson Industries
------------------------------------------------------------------
Seriously, I've looked into it.
Because I have Silent Choice, add new exhaust. What's that, $2K for a staggered set up? Process: make it in PVC, ship$ it (oversize probably$) to someone to make out of stainless and polish it and ship???it back. Install it and cuss because it doesn't fit and do it again.
"IF" my cables work. When has any boat mod ever "just worked"? Same with PS hoses and the helm/wheel.
Tie bar is needed on Arneson.
Tie bar needs to be shortened on SCX. Much cheaper
Transom PU's and strainers are the same
Props are the same
Labor:
Pull drives and helmets(already have IMCO rings), mount reservoir bottle and hook to existing line, install through hulls and strainers, install drives and fill.
VS
Pull engines, transom assemblies, helm, steering rams, cables?, hoses?, exhaust. Install through hulls, trans, drive, steering, etc. Now possibly have to glass the pad(I can't recall what Rik said, but I think so).
What'd I miss? Tons I'm sure but you get the basic idea
I can do all the labor but for someone that couldn't it's probably $5K more to install an Arneson.
Arneson $23125, exhaust $2K, through hull and misc. $2K times 2 = $54250+Props(6 Bl)=$65K+
SCX4 MSRP$15220, helmet FREE last month, reservoir 335, box not necessary, through hull and misc $500 times 2 = $32110+Props(5 Bl)=$40500+
I would absolutely LOVE to install the Arnesons. They're more efficient. They've been tried. They work. They HAVE a WARRANTY!!!!
SCX4 is more cost effective IF it works. -4 hasn't been tried on my boat. There is NO WARRANTY.
As for selling off old parts. How many old parts do we all have laying around that we "could" sell. Some are easy, like the drives and props, but the exhaust, steering, bell housings, couplers, etc have about a 1/4 to no value so we just keep them until forced to sell by the little woman.
12-02-2011 | 07:48 AM
#155
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,194
Likes: 1
From: Delaware
With the Arneson bravo conversion kit, and assuming that I didnt need to rework my transom (which i would) because my engine is too high, The skill level necessary to install all new steering, pull the motor and install the bellhousing and transmission, then install everything else, it is not as simple as just bolting on a drive. How many hours would that take?
I am not saying that I wouldnt rather have an arneson, because I would, but the amount of work involved for the arneson vs scx4 is not even close.
12-02-2011 | 08:30 AM
#156
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 323
Likes: 0
From: Cumming GA
I think Rik needs to bust in here with a 50% off xmas sale and I'll order some up and let you know how the install goes!!!!
It will be much easier for me. My motors are on drive lines and my steering is on the imco transom assemblies. My notches would be the biggest problem for me
It will be much easier for me. My motors are on drive lines and my steering is on the imco transom assemblies. My notches would be the biggest problem for me
12-07-2011 | 10:17 PM
#157
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
SCX for Redline 26
my rpm is nearly finished and is in the rigging stage. steve ordered the scx-4 for my boat and graciously agreed to test is on his boat first. with encouraging results on his boat, it will be installed on mine. i also have an N/A big block like his, only 33 cubes bigger. he should be testing it on my boat within a few weeks if all goes well. the engine is being built by Precsion Marine in LA and should be on the dyno soon. it is a 598 with AFR heads and EFI.
since my boat is so close, there will not be any more testing on steve's boat. results will be posted once my boat is sorted out.
i might have gotten by with an XR, but i have broken so many that i wanted some reliability. if the speed is equal to an XR, i will be satisfied.
since my boat is so close, there will not be any more testing on steve's boat. results will be posted once my boat is sorted out.
i might have gotten by with an XR, but i have broken so many that i wanted some reliability. if the speed is equal to an XR, i will be satisfied.
12-08-2011 | 07:31 AM
#158
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 88
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Why are the arnesons so expensive. If they are really 60k, why would anyone buy them, because the mercury 6 dry is roughly that same price. Just saying
12-08-2011 | 10:34 AM
#160
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 16
From: Renton, Wa
#6 weighs more and has more parasitic HP loss. I think the #6 can take more HP than the Arneson/Bravo conversion so if that's the case you'd run a #6 or standard Arneson, both of which would take considerable rerigging. At that point I'd add those costs up and I think the Arneson is less expensive and the way to go.
