Pro charger
 

HI guys,
I want to upgrade my 502mpi with a pro charger . Do I need a ECU reprogram ? Injectors upgrade ? Hi pressure fuel pump ?
What do i need to upgrade for the pro charger ?

Also if someone has a used 502Mpi pro charge for sale let me know please

You need a checkbook with a lot of $$$ in the account and and engine builder that knows what he is doing.

Why ?

Do I need a ECU reprogram ? Yes, Injectors upgrade ? probably, High pressure fuel pump ? probably new fuel system that can supply enough fuel for the added HP. What do i need to upgrade for the pro charger ? Depends on how much HP you're planning to add. Possibly: Fuel system, exhaust system, head gaskets, inconel exhaust valves, outdrive.

An extra 100hp was planning

Yes new fuel pump, fuel regulator, ECM reprogram, may be able to get by with factory injectors, depending on the boat cutting things to make it fit.

Yes, Yes, Yes

Do not listen to someone who says they can "tune" your computer without having the motor. If you really want it to live you need to have the ECU programmed as built on a dyno (or at least while running on the water). If you have more than 200 hours on the motor I'd recommend a re-fresh/re-build depending on it's condition.....since it's a 502 it's likely 10+ years old and if un-opened since new your asking for trouble IMO.

supercharger
 

vortech makes a complete kit to achieve 570hp. it comes with pre-programed ecu and map sensor. no modifications to fuel system. I think the kit comes with an extra electric fuel pump and
a fuel pressure optimizer. I think the kit is north of 5,000. To bad I just sold a good used one for 2000. If you have a late model 502 with mefi3 ecu and serpentine belts, it is a pretty bolt and go system. If you want to email me I can send you the install manual. it works great for what it is

larry

Drive

where do u want to drive to?

Check out this thread: http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...ger-users.html

At post #25 Artic Friends aka "Smitty" posted; through the years I read his post regarding engines and Prochargers, he has been there and done that. I would think he can a valuable resource for anyone with Procharger questions. Send him a PM and see if he can give you solid advice and guidance.

Second thread about fuel system questions with more advice:

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...questions.html

This may help you gather information to help you sort out your questions, and make contacts who can properly answer your technical questions. Good luck.

Stephen

agreed smitty is THE man when it comes to getting the max out of a 502mpi. I think he is north of 1000hp! He has helped me with my new build. Not sure how familiar he would be with a simple engineered bolt on kit to get 100 to 200 hp without serious modifications. I am not sure of procharger has a complete bolt on kit, but i have experience with the vortech kit. it worked awesome. Maybe whipple has an engineered complete bolt on kit. I do not know
Larry

There have been a lot of used Prochargers on Ebay in past few years , keep your eyes open for one.
Fuel system-On low boost apps Procharger likes to claim you can simply get by with stock injectors, fuel lines, etc and a boost referencing rising rate regulator with stock ecu. You can actually make quite a lot of hp on stock injectors once you turn the fuel press up, the problem is a rising rate regulator just blindly increases the output of the injectors when you go into boost. They work irratically and your boat will end up rich somewhere with the transom black and the regulators they provide never work the same twice. Having the ecu programmed for your boat is the best idea.
A good point was also brought up, IF your motor is original to your boat and is 13-19 years old it might not be such a great idea to start boosting it now without going thru and rebuilding/inspecting and upgrading everything.
In the end, keep in mind that even if you find a good used kit for $2500 , that will quickly double and triple if ypou ugrade anything else or break something

You will need to add fuel for the 100HP, plus additional fuel for HP the blower is taking to make the 100. Anything that acts like a cork in the system will rob HP in the form of back pressure
on the blower making it harder to turn.

You will need:

-fuel pump (aeromotive A1000) and a boost referenced regulator.

-new fuel feed line/lines

-fuel return line to the fuel tank (must drill/tap a hole in the tank or sending unit if there isn't a return there already)

-ECM will need to be tuned without a doubt...the instructions in the kit will say that it doesn't but they're clearly crackheads.

-will probably need to change props as well

You could do a compression test and a cylinder leak down test to get an idea of the condition of the engine, but freshening the motor or being ready to at the least will be a good idea.

Keeping these things in mind will get you in the direction you're looking to go.

Can I buy a program for the ECM from someone with the same stock setup of a pro charger M1 kit ?

Never tried it, I run the aftermarket stuff, but I believe you can send them out and have them re-flashed.

the vortech kit comes with all of the components ENGINEERED to work together to work with a stock late model 502. comes with a modifed ecu.
No fuel return required
No aeromotive fuel pump
No new fuel lines requires
You need a base motor in good condition and you may need to reprop tp keep it in the rpm range.
You will need a sea strainer, and a dump for the intercooler water exit
That's it, if you buy the kit

buy an m1 procharger and then the best way is the areomotive pump, larger fuel lines, tank return etc.
eddie youngblood, or mark at precision marine can probably reprogram your ecu for the set up. you will also need a 2 bar map sensor. the procharger will need to come with all the brackets, intercooler, pipes etc. you will still need a sea strainer and water dump.

I didn't think Vortech was still making marine kits?

I just copied and pasted my own response from a previous thread on Prochargers.

IMO, there are several things that should be done if you want it to live a long life and run to its potential.
First, you should change the head gaskets to Cometics. If you are going to run over about 3 psi, then the exhaust valves should be changed to something like Manley's Inconel valves. You will also need to upgrade the fuel system. Take the Procharger regulator and throw it in the garbage. Use a standard 1:1 boost referenced regulator, like an Aeromotive. I would replace not only the fuel filter head to a larger one, but also the fuel lines and the pickup in the tank if it isn't large enough.(most are not large enough in production type boats) The fuel return should go back to the fuel tank. If the engine has over 200-250 hours, you should freshen up the heads. You will need to turn it a little harder than the stock 5050 rpm to take full advantage of the power. At 5 psi of boost, it will pull to about 5300 rpm.

Depending on the year of the 502 mags, there were 3 different versions of the fuel rails. The pre 99 versions have a few issues. The supply hole to the #7 injector needs to be opened up in a mill. Also, the rail should be fed fuel from both ends so that one end isn't run dry. There are quite a few other mods that needs to be done to the rail in order to make it really work correctly. The 99 and up rail needs less mods. It still should be fed from both ends, but it is already threaded for 1/4" NPT, so it's much easier to do.

With 5 psi boost, you should be in the 625 hp area. The stock injectors are good to about 650 hp without killing them by running them to hard. You can make more than 650, but it takes its toll on the injectors. If you have a pre 99 fuel rail, then you will have the Keihin injectors. There are no drop in replacements that are larger than the stockers. You can install larger injectors but it requires drilling out both the intake and the rails. If you have a 99 and up, they use the shorty injectors, so they can be replaced with larger ones if you want to make more power.

The other thing that must be addressed in the ecm. Obviously, it will need to be retuned. The best bet is to put it on the dyno and tune it.

We have done a TON of these. I actually have a few in the shop now that we are doing. If you have any questions or need any help, don't hesitate to give me a call anytime.
Eddie
615-216-7449 shop
504-416-3607 cell

eddie, should i make a funny comment about fuel tank pickups?
when do you think you can get around to them? before spring i hope!
larry

I'll have them for you by next week. My welder going down has really made it tough. It couldn't have happened at a worse time. I have a bunch of stuff to fabricate. I'll give you a shout when they are done.
Thanks,
Eddie

i am re considering buying the prochrager with all these mods all you told me to do .............. what can i do to upgrade it a bit just not to leave it bone stock this motor?
from what i heared the problem with the 502mpi is the air intake and inlet runner . has anyone did somthing to this ? what about a custom plenium ?
[IMG]intakedouble.jpg[/IMG]

Eddie, I found a kit at pier57.com it has everything you said less the fuel rail ! My 502 is pre 99 . If I buy this kit can you make me the fuel rail as you said in the above ?
Let me know please

IMO upgrading an engine any less then the amount of HP increase that a full build gives you or a procharger gives you will be a waste of time. Lots of good advice on hear don't let it scare you away just make sure you are prepared.

I love my prochargers BTW!

Just remember to plan for more expensive maintence. Drive failures and upgrades. And most importantly the " speed itch" that won't stop,........

If your budget does not feel comfortable its no big deal. Just enjoy stock powerboats more often on the water then being broke down at the dock with a ";faster" powerboat.

Don't let what I posted scare you away. You can have a very reliable piece if done correctly. If you want to keep it NA, you will have to spend quite a bit to make any substantial gains. You will spend as much or more to make the power that the Procharger will make. Which ever way you go, just be sure to work with someone reputable that has done it before and knows how to do it correctly the first time, or you will be sorry that you ever laid a finger on it.
Eddie

The Procharger kit doesn't come with a fuel rail. You use your existing rail. I would be more than happy to do the rail for you. Just give me a shout and we can take care of it.
Eddie

I went through 3 engines on ecm's not programmed on the dyno. Do it on the dyno or the very least in the boat. If not you will hole a piston or burn a valve, guaranteed!

I forgot all about the head gaskets.... :)

One thing that I forgot to mention. No matter which way you go, some of the mods will need to be done anyway. Depending on the power, and if you keep the Mag intake, you may still need the fuel rail mods, the filter head, the tank pickup, etc. All of your current parts were made to support a 415 hp engine. Now, you want to make 600 hp or possibly more, so a lot of those parts aren't up to the task.

I would be glad to help you in any way I can. You can reach me anytime @ 615-216-7449.
Eddie

On racing junk last week there was a f2 for big block with all brackets 3100 brand new I thought that was a good deal . I'm not a master but I think all you would need is the air to water box. Or whatever in the marine industry calls them. When I ran an f1 we called it air to water and had a fuel cell in back with ice water and aero motive street pump to move the water. Steve matusek is awesome to deal with he owns aeromotive. I grew up in Merriam Kansas and them and ati ie procharger go hand and hand.

You have to send it out to get it done, or buy all the crap that you have to use to tune the POS Merc ECU. I dont know a whole lot about them, we run a MegaSquirt ECM in the Checkmate and I tune it using that...so much better.

We arent trying to tell you not to do it, but its heartbreaking to see people spend a bunch of money on a kit, follow the garbage instructions and go out and melt their **** down the first weekend.

It all comes down to the old saying "Speed cost money, how fast do you want to go?"

and

-Good
-Fast
-Cheap

You get to pick 2.

I dont think you can buy a race blower like that and use it on the boat unless they sell the mounting bracket/plate seperately for a marine application. A car plate wont have the correct holes/mounting locations and spacers/bolts for the accessories on the front of the motor.

There is NO free lunch and with procharger your paying more for the atmosphere then the food 2c

Eddie,
First of all thank you for your help, if it wasnt for you i whould have trashed this idea.
I decided to go for the procharger kit that pier57 have which comes complete with fuel lines, pump , filter , programed ecm and headers . The problem is that i live in malta europe a very small island , and here we dont have a dyno for an engine only, we only have rolling roads dyno's for cars. So its imposible to setup engine.
When i raced bikes i used to Powercomander auto-tune, with this you make a run you plug it your computer and it will give you corrections you need to do to your ECM.
Is there somthing like this avalible in the market ?

yes, check out the Holley HP EFI system.... check out this thread-

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/g...-everyone.html

Yes, by the same guys that make the power commander. http://www.dynojetcmd.com/

Guys i opened a new thread on the Dynojet ! As if its good for my procharger project i get it too

bulitz

i talked with keith at dyno jet for 1/2 hr today about their piggy back systems and they seem real good. you must buy a 2 bar map the cable and a dattalogger/02 sensor to fine tune your afr. it will cost you over 1100 when your done