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Old 01-11-2023 | 07:32 PM
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Not saying do not evaluate and fix what is necessary, but devils advocate.
When I first joined OSO in 2003 every other thread was "330 On Roids". (those who know, know...) It seemed everyone was building 475-500HP cast crank 454's and many were using hypereutectic pistons. I believe Blue Thunder was pushing 5-7lbs boost to his with 177's for years without issue. I just did a search in the Tech section and I did not find any threads that were related to a broken cast crank or an engine destroyed by hyper pistons failing compared to valve trains taking engines out? I could be totally wrong but I was always of the understanding that cast cranks were good to build to 500 and hyper pistons were good to 600HP on a NA BBC. Also, hyper pistons don't expand that much, so on a honed used marine block I don't believe he'd have that tight of piston to wall clearance. Still do your due diligence.
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Old 01-11-2023 | 07:41 PM
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Do you mind me asking how much you paid to get these done by this shop?
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Old 01-11-2023 | 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Rookie
Not saying do not evaluate and fix what is necessary, but devils advocate.
When I first joined OSO in 2003 every other thread was "330 On Roids". (those who know, know...) It seemed everyone was building 475-500HP cast crank 454's and many were using hypereutectic pistons. I believe Blue Thunder was pushing 5-7lbs boost to his with 177's for years without issue. I just did a search in the Tech section and I did not find any threads that were related to a broken cast crank or an engine destroyed by hyper pistons failing compared to valve trains taking engines out? I could be totally wrong but I was always of the understanding that cast cranks were good to build to 500 and hyper pistons were good to 600HP on a NA BBC. Also, hyper pistons don't expand that much, so on a honed used marine block I don't believe he'd have that tight of piston to wall clearance. Still do your due diligence.
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yup, lots back then. I don’t think all went unscathed.

For anyone:
Google better search for oso stuff then search in oso.

copy/paste this and put in google

330 on roids : offshoreonly.com

Last edited by SB; 01-11-2023 at 08:34 PM.
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Old 01-11-2023 | 08:29 PM
  #104  
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Thanks Rookie, That is good info and it does make me feel better about my builds and the piston choice.
My problem is that the other guy wants to put forged pistons in or I don't think he will do the work. It is his name on the line and forged pistons are not wrong so....The other thing is I saw earlier that it was mentioned too that the piston clearance can't possibly be what they stated because the bore still shown as stock size and stock size pistons installed and the hours on the engines etc. So the only thing left is that he must have "Forged the info" that he gave to me. That is worse than being ignorant in your profession. At least that's my opinion. In the end a man only has his word....
Wildman, I am reluctant to tell you the dollar amount because it is sure to open another rabbit hole and I'm not sure I can take another trip.
I'm sure I will forget some stuff but you guys know more than me so here goes.
For the money, he disassembled the short blocks. I had already torn them down including cam removal because in the beginning I was only installing a "top end kit". Hot tank clean etc. Should have new cam bearings bronze or brass (not sure which) freeze plugs normal drill I suppose. Balance the reciprocating parts he supplied the main and rod bearings new connecting rods pistons then installed all of my supplied parts from the cam up. He ended up not using my roller rockers so he supplied those along with figuring out the pushrod lengths and suppling those. Complete assembly of course. Painted the blocks black again. Dyno tuned the best he could. At least I heard them run. He did have to jet the carbs up I think 2 numbers. As far as suppling stuff, he was in charge of the short block stuff basically. Just under 9k. Lets not have this discussion please.
Still looking for a number range from someone to do the work I asked about.
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Old 01-11-2023 | 09:05 PM
  #105  
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you have your engines in a good place at P.E. nick and the guys have built hundreds of marine engine including mine.

follow their advice and trust their workmanship. i'm not rich, i work everyday and it took years for my to be in a position to afford to build my engines and i chose the builder carefully.

your problem now is you have about 15 chef's all giving you their recipes, just tell P.E. what you are looking for and your budget and go from there. i have never seen these guys run up the bill on anyone.

the engines the guy down the road said i'd regret not having him build and rig....

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Old 01-12-2023 | 05:38 AM
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Very Nice! I like the red. I couldn't find the matching red flame arrestor where I bought my valve covers so just stainless. Looking at your photo and others gives me more ideas for rigging my boat. I am waiting for Kyle @ PE to get back to me on the specifics for my engines and the cost. I'm really hoping the other guy comes up with some money but I don't really see that happening. Blood from a turnip and all.
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Old 01-12-2023 | 06:39 AM
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Holy crap this thread blew up!! Hahaha sorry been away for a couple days

Saber....I heard countless stories like yours about PE and that's why I went there however my experience was NOT as described. I don't like bashing people on the internet but being this thread is to educate and help PQ I will disclose some of my experience.

I will include pics to show the outcome. I paid them to assemble, machine, dyno my motor...the works they had it from day one. Ultimately I ended up with a stuck valve, ruined piston, 2 seasons of boating, ruined rocker arms, ruined head castings, and an enormous RAN UP BILL since it was brought up. I know everyone can have a bad day and sh!t happens but what ruined my experience was their lack of ownership for their work and the professionalism to make it right.

Valve clearances were set at less than .001 which is obviously a no go
Push rod length was too short on exhausts if I remember right causing the rockers to bind and get ruined
The head guy that Dan(ICDEDPPL) recommended got my heads after the stuck valve and found all this...
PE did take the heads back and go through them again after the stuck valve and not being confident I went to Dan's guy with them untouched and he found that it broke the guide casting in the head and PE jb welded it back on never telling me what happened...the clearance he found was set to .001 which would have seized a valve again if used.
I don't remember numbers but the springs that PE sourced, sold me, and installed were so light that I was floating the valves at 4900 and the motor would not run over that rpm...remember they "dynoed" this motor to 5600 and 5 lbs of boost according to their sheet they gave me.
In the end, the bottom end was done pretty well but I ended up starting over with all new parts, went to a 540, bigger blower, heads built by Mike(Dan's guy), machine work done by another shop, all assembled by yours truly, cam spec'd by Mild Thunder, push rod length determined by me, and all put together then installed in the boat. So far 15 hours in all is well. Full disclosure I do have an oil leak that is my fault and I'm upgrading my EFI/ignition this off season but the nuts and bolts of the engine are still kicking strong.

Now...this is my experience with them and I get it every shop has bad days but what turned me away was the second time they "went through" the heads to make them right and almost 2 years in PE basically told me this is it and you're on your own good luck. NEVER ONCE did they tell me that there was any issue with the heads or that the seized valve broke the casting. Got them back and they were "good to go" good luck..obviously as stated above that was not the case...the bill was 1300 bucks higher than quoted with no explanation as to why...was just told that more parts were needed yet was never called and told..I asked what parts and the owner of the company told me he doesn't know and "didn't want to bug his builder to find out and it is what it is"

Just a bad experience all the way around and I will personally not go back...now as I said right at the beginning....I heard numerous great stories like Saber's but this was mine so take it for what it's worth.

Here's some pics....this motor had dyno time and a half mile of idleing with 200 yards of 4800 rpm when these pics were taken....







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Old 01-12-2023 | 06:51 AM
  #108  
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My personal suggestion as to your motors specifically....

I would absolutely have the heads gone through and at least checked and/or corrected before running them. Remember a 5 second sweep on the dyno is A LOT different than pushing the weight of a boat at 5 grand for an hour. I would also keep a close eye on carb jetting as like I said a dyno pull is way different than real world.

I personally think your bottom ends will be fine if you NEVER plan on boosting it and you are conservative on your timing/carb jetting. If you try to ring every HP out of them and get close to or start detonating those pistons are not going to be happy. MY OPINION and take it for what it's worth..I don't find the pistons to be anymore of a weak link than the cast crank which to me for what you're doing I also believe will be just fine.

I am no professional engine builder by any means but those are my opinions...if you search my threads I have asked a lot of questions and learned a TON on this site and don't feel like you're getting attacked...most of us are just trying to help and save you time, money, and grief on the front end before you end up like me with piles of junk broken parts and 2 years of boating gone.

Good luck brotha and keep your head up!! You'll get there...this boating thing has a really harsh learning curve as you are finding out hahaha
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Old 01-12-2023 | 07:40 AM
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Top ring gap on KB pistons is critical. Bigger is better. When they run out of gap, it pops the top ring land right off.

Last edited by snapmorgan; 01-12-2023 at 07:52 AM.
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Old 01-12-2023 | 07:53 AM
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I am just going to leave this here in case anyone needs it

Machine shop services in the Midwest - Offshoreonly.com
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