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Old 12-11-2002, 11:28 PM
  #161
Tom
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Quote:
Originally posted by SABER28
yes tom we do share a passion for performance , just different ways of getting there
Now your starting to sound like my wife.
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Old 12-12-2002, 12:06 AM
  #162
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You guys are killing me! I'm so impressed with the knowledge and trivia everyone can dig up when put to the test. Tom you seem to know more than you let on. I'm thinking that must be the case if one gets into the "BatBoat" versus something else, then claims ignorance about steps/V's.

Again, I state that posts like this are far more boat-intellectually challenging than the monotonous "OT" dribble that has infested this board lately. I remember back when I first joined in the fall of 2000 how stimulating the posts were compared to the sludge I now see. It feels good to be able to just read sometimes versus clicking on a post and going.....huh???? Who the ...k cares?!

I've read the V bottom history (with comments) and the Cat history (though more in the read than respond mode) and those posts remain two of my all-time topics. Makes you think. Makes you challenge conventional wisdom. And maybe confirms all that you believed, bringing just a little sh%t eating grin to your face...And that's worth the time spent surfing this site...
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Old 12-12-2002, 08:19 AM
  #163
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Know who built the first modern stepped v-bottom? Bob Hobbs, 1963, called "The Pistol". It was a 19' X 7 1/2' boat, powered by a 165 hp Mercruiser sterndrive with a Full-time shaft dyno in the driveline. Bob and Dick Cole brought it up to Donzi in 1966 when I hosted the Society of Naval Architects and Marine Engineers meeting. He was building a full time thrust meter to be installed in the near future. Bob designed lots of stepped boats in those days. He was quite brilliant, but quirky and difficult. (reminds me of someone on the board whose handle ends in "x")
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Old 12-12-2002, 08:27 AM
  #164
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Brownie, What was the purpose of the full time shaft dyno on the driveline. To measure the hull-- that is to measure the hulls requirements to go a certain speed? Sort of like dynoing a hull.
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Old 12-12-2002, 08:32 AM
  #165
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Rick,

I couldn't agree more.

There should be some way of rating the posts or maybe have a section just for intelegent boat conversations.
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Old 12-12-2002, 09:02 AM
  #166
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If you know the speed, thrust, weight, and horsepower, you know more than anyone else I know in the evaluation area. We always estimate (guess) at two or three (or four) of the these criteria. I don't wish to crowd the board with equations, but if you want to know, email me at "[email protected]", and I will share some of our Black Art.
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Old 12-12-2002, 09:05 AM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally posted by BROWNIE
Know who built the first modern stepped v-bottom? Bob Hobbs, 1963, called "The Pistol". It was a 19' X 7 1/2' boat, powered by a 165 hp Mercruiser sterndrive with a Full-time shaft dyno in the driveline. Bob and Dick Cole brought it up to Donzi in 1966 when I hosted the Society of Naval Architects and Marine Engineers meeting. He was building a full time thrust meter to be installed in the near future. Bob designed lots of stepped boats in those days. He was quite brilliant, but quirky and difficult. (reminds me of someone on the board whose handle ends in "x")

Okay........That's the tie breaker. Brownie has now surpassed Fabio...and is the undisputed champion of humor in the offshore world........ May I also add that "brilliant", "quirky" and "difficult" can also be used in describing Alan.

Reminds me of his theme song...."Mrs. Brown, I'm trying to find my daughter".

T2x


P.S. Mr. Offshore: Cincy on Father's Day sounds good...maybe Reggie will be there and he can demonstrate his "Best throttling and Driving skills in the World".
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Old 12-12-2002, 09:40 AM
  #168
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShipWrecked
Harry seems to be a genius "also", but he just doesn't know how to market himself, IF he did, we would be seeing his accomplishments everywhere. By the way, WHAT has e done lately?
Active Thunder AVH
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Old 12-12-2002, 10:33 AM
  #169
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T2X and MrOffshore,

Father's Day race Cincinnati 2003 it is then. We will also be having a Celebrity we would be honored to have you race in, should you feel comfortable in the boat.

Chris Reindl
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Old 12-12-2002, 12:55 PM
  #170
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Quote:
Originally posted by Reckless288
Tom you seem to know more than you let on. I'm thinking that must be the case if one gets into the "BatBoat" versus something else, then claims ignorance about steps/V's.
Intelligence is the opposite of stupidity. Ignorance is the opposite of experienced. I have seen very experienced people post really stupid things and very intelligent people that are very ignorant about a particular topic. Hopefully I fit in the second catagory since I am pretty ignorant about boats.I can fit my whole life experience in this post.

When I was two years old my mother says she was in the basement doing laundry when water started coming through from the living room. I was filling the room with water from the tub so I could float my imaginary boat to grandma's. I ended up with lots of boats for the tub.

When the tidy bowl man switched from a rowboat to a little red speedboat I was hooked. My father had a junky family boat and we went skiing every summer in Michigan. Somebody on lake Huron had a Monza and it was a very cool boat built in Florida wherever that is. It was a takeoff of a Donzi whatever that is. (i mean at the time)

From 16 to 38 no boats, but for my birthday I saw a red 18ft classic donzi and bought it on a whim. First day out was the San Francisco fleet parade and I got swamped by a ferry boat. Next couple months I ventured further and further out in bigger and bigger waves till I could run in four footers at 63 mph. People said I was crazy but I didn't realize how close to the edge I was. I really got good at working the waves and believe I would have to go a lot faster in much bigger waves for the same thrill in a bigger boat. Had a friend with a bertram race boat that handled the waves like I couldn't believe. I wanted a bigger boat.

Saw a 28 batboat at a show in Oakland and had a test ride, didn't even drive, but was totally blown away. blew by the Bertram in rough water like he was standing still. Flew to England to ride in the 24s since I thought they looked so cool. Told the guy he had to drive a lot faster to convince me and he barely did. Talked Ocke into letting me put in a 502. Armada built it and it took forever. During the wait I test rode (never drove anything) 32 Nordic and Warlock and found them boring compared to the batboat I was waiting for.

Blew up the engine and drive after ten hours and put in new HP drive and 650 HP engine. Been out in it five times with the new engine, but every time whoever is there is so blown away and so am I. One guy took me in 4 footers at 72 in his 28 Shockwave Cat and told me my boat is too small, blah, blah, blah like everyone else never in it says. Took him in the same waves at 85 and he drinks Ocke's coolaid daily begging for another ride. I would really like to go in a Skater and find out what it is like since many say it is the best cat representative. Oh yeah, went in a 23? warlock cat that went $110+ and it wouldn't have a chance against me in rough water.

innocently posted my enthusiasm on OSO and am attacked and accused of everything from blasphemy to stupidity. With this as my resume I'll admit ignorance, but I'm not stupid. Most of my posts are either attempts at comedy or trying to dig out more info. I really have no idea why my boat either intimidates those who never rode in one or blows away those who have. All I know is I love driving it and will take anyone who wants for a ride. I would also love to ride in somebody elses any boat. Ocke says it is the combination of steps, straight strakes, wings, speed rails, and aerodynamic shape and I tend to believe him. Nobody has offered any reason other than name calling as to why he is wrong and blasphemous. Experienced and stupid comes to mind when I hear that kind of thing.

My latest take on steps: They change the angle of attack and reduce wetted surface therefore making the boat faster and quicker to plane, but only in flat water. If not engineered properly it may not work at all. Once you get into chop the waves do the same thing anyway. In calm water they probably will help you win even if they only make up for 1 MPH, so why not use them? One reason not to use them is that they MAY increase the odds of spinning out, but I've heard no reason other than name calling to justify the claim. Maybe it is because it breaks up the surface where the strake is cutting the water to make the turn and causes the back end to slip. Maybe the turbulence created by the step is both the reason for speed increase and lack of alleged strong grip in the turn. Are there no engineers doing wind tunnel, computer simulations, etc.? If people can get grants to study how a hummingbird flies, why can't a student study hydrodynamics of performance boats?

Everything I know about boats both right and wrong I learned on OSO.

Last edited by Tom; 12-12-2002 at 01:29 PM.
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