Old boat dilema, Build it or pass on it??
 

So an interesting situation has arisen in the past few hours. I got a call from a guy i went to school with. His older brother (who i was also good friends with) passed away last month. The family has this 28SS Cig that they have owned for as long as i can remember knowing them. About 20-25 years ago i helped the older brother redo the boat....new gauges, cut two hatches into the deck, got it painted and graphics put on etc....Since he is alone now (Dad died a number of years back) and he is more into cars than boats he wants me to have the boat.
Not free, but too good to pass up i think.....
She has always been stored indoors in a factory out of the elements...
The boat has twin SBC's that in its day were pushing around 400hp (dynoed at 396hp and 403hp)
it has the MercII trans and TRS drives
right now the boat needs a real good cleaning as its been sitting for the past 15+ years
Needs both drives rebuilt as one had water in it last time out...
and one motor got the milkshake last time out as well...
So at a min it would need both drives gone through and one motor rebuilt assuming the other is still good.

So my dilemma is do i get the boat and just fix what it needs at a min to get her going and cross my fingers the trannies are still good and the other motor is solid....
Or do i got rebuild both motors(or buy two running motors) and go through the drives and cross fingers the trannies are good...
Or do i scrap all of it and maybe build some stand off box's to adapt from the TRS to a bravo drive and ditch the trannies? Which leads to me another question....has anyone built their own stand off boxes? I have drawn something up on CAD and its easily doable...currently drawn up for a 12" setback with a 1" rise and the TRS side has +/- 1" of adjustment up/down if needed... I may just start a separate thread on this question...

So i am a glutten for punishment and i have a soft spot for this boat since ive worked on it before....the question is should I? And which route would be best? :D

I would have to pull the drivetrain apart to make a determination but I would lean towards the stand-off boxes and the Bravos to free up some room in that tight azz engine room.

Also we need pics.

Why stand off boxes?

id pull the motors and rebuild them, then at least you know for sure they’re fresh and healthy vs buying unknowns. Yank the TRS stuff and trans out and slap a couple bravos on it and call
it a day.

and yeah, post some pics!!!

also, buddy CNC’d billet stand off boxes on his 38 scarab with Teague 800 SC’s and 3A’s. The trannies sat in the boxes so the motors were so far forward.

But like I said Id yank everything and pit standard bravos / no boxes.

Those engine compartments in the 28 are tight! I did impellers on one and pretty much did the entire job on both motors by feel only cause you can't see anything. I would definitely wait to make the call on what you do until you start tearing it apart, and then consider your long term goals.

We restored the Jesse James 28SS a few years ago. Do not put boxes on that boat...the last thing it needs is more bow lift. We mounted bravos on it as high as we could get them. 385hp small blocks, Rev 4 props, runs low 70s over anything. Great boat.
The merctrans are a time bomb...the trs are sturdy but obsolete. If putting bravos on it is in the budget or skill set, its worth it.

Wally,,
all I can tell you is, the boat is sitting on top of a hell of a trailer

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My friend Peter's 28. Started life as a Volvo boat. We converted his boat and my 27 Magnum to TRS & Merctrans late 70's. Put the drives into the rub rail. He had 400 cu in small blocks 400 hp and his boat would run 80. Back then the fastest props were the cleavers.
They are great boats. I think I agree with Team Saris. No box, move the drives up.

My only reason for thinking about boxes is it would be easy to not have to fill the transom up and re-cut for the bravos...The box would be an adapter per-say....less fiberglass work to do.
Ive seen another local 28 cig that had 500efi's and boxes (not sure what drives were on it though) that was pushing in to the 90's...but he said it gets hairy at those speeds :D

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Heres some before/during/and after pics of her :)
that pic of it running was her last time out during a local run here in Chicago with the older brother running her :ernaehrung004:

Its a 1976 bicentennial edition....it has a 3-man bolster in front right now. Thats how it came stock from the factory. In those pics she had two bolsters in front that were removed for another project and the 3-man was put back in...

And believe it or not...still the same color since you sold it to him!!! LOL all we did was cut and weld the bunk support to fit this boat. It was an great trailer too...just needs a paint job :)

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Oh heres a pic of that 28SS with the 500Efi motors....i forgot they were procharged too!! You can see the boxes barely in the back there....all white...

Unless I missed it....its a 40+ year old transom...more than likely you'll find its worth replacing or at least filling in properly.

Buy it sell it to me...........:ernaehrung004:

Having some room in the engine bay to work and inspect is priceless.

That said, TRS are a robust drive. The Merctrans II is not bad, if setup well, and the fluid is kept cool. The Nemesis is that it hold only 1 liter of fluid, with a very poor cooling system. But they're a shorter package than the BW trans by about 8".

As mentioned, I would pull the engines and go through them. If you go with Bravos, the exhaust will have to be re-worked.

If you can swing the cash, Bravos would be a better long term plan, with more initial work now. SBCs on Bravos would be gentle, but you could still get some good power out of them.

If you do your own work, you can sell the TRS stuff, and offset the Bravo parts etc.

But there would be a lot of work.

My suggestion would be to go with the plan of least resistance to getting on the water.

Right now it's pulling the engines/drives...having a look, repair as required, and install. Maybe a Bravo prop upgrade. Keep with the 3 blades. TRS don't like the 4 blade bite.

I think the plan of attack as of right now will be to see if the other engine still runs.. Do a leak down test and check out the exhausts and decide where to go from there. I know both trannies worked when put away but sitting there for 15+ years im not sure if anything will be affected...If both engines need a rebuild then i think its bravo time and a new transom.
If i can get away with just rebuilding the other engine and have the drives gone through then i will keep it as is for now and start collecting parts for a future update while we enjoy it. :D

Making the boxes still is on my mind as its easier then doing glass work and cutting new holes. I wouldnt need the inner transom plate as i can use a rear engine mounting plate to not worry about the rear mounts. Its all ready got the offshore engine plates up front and i have a CAD file to make a set for the rear....not sure how much difference there is in weight between the TRS and a bravo drive or the weight of the trannies but i think with the drives getting set back 12" it should change the CG too much,,,,and if it does i can always move the batteries as far back as possible and maybe add two more ;)

Thats not mine...it was a guy that i believe used to work for Gaffrig (before they changed to Livorsi) It was at a fun run up to Racine WI back in the very early days of OSO :) Dont know if he still has it or not...was a cool machine for sure

You may be right...wont know till i see the boat up close.....but what it has going for it is that its been stored indoors most of its life...At least the last 25years or so and used very little overall

I'd vote for converting to Bravos as well. Whatever you decide though, I can't wait to see how it progresses

BUILD IT< cool boat and story. Thanks for posting Wally. Following.....

I always thought a 27 Magnum or a 28SS would be a great Candidate for a staggered shortie Bravo setup with some aluminum 6 liter LS motors .

Its not so much the weight moving the CG back as the added leverage for the props...even with the bravos right on the transom the JJ Cig (which is heavy being a raceboat) requires tab to tame the porpoise. Standoff boxes is only going make that worse....plus youll need shorties or boxes that angle up to get the same effective drive height. They run really great right on the transom...just some heavy advice again. OK..im out lol. Whatever you do, Im glad you're doing it. Way too many people run away from these projects, but then also ***** that nobody makes a cool 28 IO sportboat anymore. Do it up!

That is a good looking boat !

Keep in mind those pics were almost 15-20yrs ago and shes been sitting in a factory this entire time....probably uncovered. Wont know the actual state of affairs until i get to see it in person.
But it did look good when it was done back then...she does need some more love though :)

Glad to see that the discussion shifted from whether or not to do it to how to do it.

You can figure out the how once you own it, though.

:signs069:

Its as good as mine...just figuring out some storage logistics right now :D

Hummm...Bracket and outboards? Someone had to say it.:boat: :popcorn:

John

Believe me that thought had crossed my mind as well....but in the end i'm still a sucker for the visceral noise of an open exhaust of a healthy V8 :evilb:

I have a 24x50 available..............:drink:...........when you going to see it ?

asap :ernaehrung004:

I've always had a "thing" for 28ft boats, but never have been a fan of the 28 cigarette. I like the outboard idea.

I hear what your saying....My "ideal" boat would be like a 28 or 31 sonic with twins and then maybe an Active thunder or Scarab in the 31' range...but this kinda fell into my lap so who am i to say no ;)

Is there fuel in the tank?...has it turned to molasses by now?.... the tank and whole fuel system might need to be replaced just another concern.

you probably shout "freebird!" at concerts too....lol.
PLEASE do not take ALL the coolness away from a classic offshore cig by converting it to OB...

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No idea...my guess would be there was some but how much is the question. And this one has two tanks with selectors.
Knowing the younger brother he would have drained the tanks of gas...but wont know until i check it out...

That double sheer that’s on the 28 Cig bugs me almost as much as the wood deck insert on the 27 Magnum.

I like the look of the old Scarab S-Types and Panthers but the quality lacks.

The 28 Pantera has the classic Look and the quality construction but not many around these days.

Looking at that Bilge and the lack of any room to work, hard pass for me.
You live close to Midway, I don`t even know where you would take this .. Lake michigan wouldn`t be much fun, need a small lake.
I think you should do the HVAC instead.. perfect time now while were slow and before they run out pf R410 equipment :D

How about converting it to a single.

Your getting spoiled with those big roomy separate engine compartments in your cat now.

It’s not only high performance boats but many cruisers and sailboats that I’ve seen the engine access and have gone Oh Hell No.

my thought as well. it is 28 feet so why not a single 500 hp big block? less weight and would probably run the same speed with more room to work. when I rigged the 30 Adrenaline's they were all twin 525's or v10 Ilmor's and ran around 108 to 110 or so. we did one that was a single 700 that ran right around 100 but felt so much more nimble than the others. it was my favorite one just because it felt so much better with out all the weight on the tail.