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are pleasure boats running too fast?

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Old 03-02-2004, 08:39 PM
  #101
GLH
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Quote:
Originally posted by clearcut3
...that accident was someone else's fault as it usually is when motorcycles are involved...
Who cares about fault when your the one wiped all over the pavement. Looks like your on the right track CC3.

Think of your parents and buy a big azz V-hull like us old folks, besides you can throw her a bang in the cabin!!!
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Old 03-02-2004, 08:40 PM
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Originally posted by mr_velocity
Education is not really the answer. The latest fatalities had nothing to do with a non-educated boater. What is really comes down to is the need for speed and the invincibility people get when they jump into these fast boats. I would never get into a boat that runs over 120 mph without a canopy, full time air and a rescue team in a helicopter. But that is my decision, others need to make their own decision on how much risk they wish to take. As long as they're not taking out innocent bystanders I don't care if you want to go 200mph on a surfboard. The government shouldn't care either and has no business regulating how you kill yourself.
I could not disagree more. Education May not stop or prevent any and all accidents but it is a step in the right direction. I don't want the government regulating us either but I don't want to be killed by the idiot who buy's an 60-70-80-mph boat that has no Idea what the hell they are doing on and runs me or my family over on the lake.

I don't care how fast they are going if they are not running people over and I don't think you do either. For example does it matter if an idiot boater runs over a swimmer at idle speed and kills them or if they are going 90mph and hit them. The issue is not speed it is knoiwledge, understanding and experience...and none of us has a complete and perfect resume with respect to all of them.

10 mph boats should not be sold to people with out any experience let alone 100mph boats.
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Old 03-02-2004, 09:02 PM
  #103
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T2X I understand the statement about liability issues involved with trainers during civil actions. It is only a concern if you are teaching incorrectly. As long as you instruct people on a accepted curiculum then you will have nothing to worry about. As a field training officer I would be held accountable if I tought somebody improperly and they based their actions on that. As long as I tought them properly, even if they go out and do something wrong, I am not held accountable. Same goes for any instructor, teach properly and you will not be held accountable if somebody decides to ignore that which youve tought them and do something stupid. I think that there should be some sort of standards and curriculum but established by boaters for boaters. Not wait until the government decides to do it for us. I say lets beat them to it and do it right. Being a Police Officer I get to see more than my fair share of reactionary rules and regulations because of the innability of Officers in the past to take the steps to correct the problems themselves. Got to the point where the government had to step in. Often times these rulings are the results of Court cases where the courts say there needs to me more regulations. I enjoy the freedom associated with power boating. Its one of the last bastions in our society that is relatively unregulated. I would like to see it that way. But the only way to protect that freedom is for us to police ourselves first, so others dont decide that they need to do it for us.
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Old 03-02-2004, 09:09 PM
  #104
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Originally posted by Ironmanwb
10 mph boats should not be sold to people with out any experience let alone 100mph boats.
Now remind us who you are again??? an elected official with legislative submission powers? No ahh ok then we don't have to worry to much yet.
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Old 03-02-2004, 10:02 PM
  #105
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I know in the past I posted a similar thread and was amazed by some of the answers I got from dealers who offered training to buyers and had instruction declined most of the time. Personally, I can't fathom dropping several hundred thousand on a vehicle/vessel that I had no idea on how to run. I think the biggest threat to this hobby are the buyers with this attitude. These are the guys that are going to go out and kill bystanders in a headline grabbing accident and cause the inevitable legislative overreaction. The unfortunate accident that happened this weekend is not the type that will cause this legislative response. The boat was being operated by experts doing what they had done a million times, and above all did not involve any other parties. I think even the legislative bodies realize that accidents do happen even to the best. I had the privelage to fly and train with The French Connection airshow team while I was in college. They were known throughout aviation as one of the best. Sadly, during a routine practice of their airshow act a couple years ago, they had a mid air collision. As tragic as this accident was (as with others of its type involving experienced pilots and their aircraft only) you never saw any legislation come of it. Then take an accident like the JFK Jr. crash. You take an extremely high profile person, put two innocent passengers with him in a high performance aircraft beyond his capabilities, and you had the perfect recipe for a media circus and the proposed legislation that came with it. Luckily for those of us in aviation, we had the powerful lobbying support of AOPA (Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association) to talk common sense into Congress and defeat most of the legislation before it spiraled out of control. We have no organization in our sport with this kind of pull, so I believe we have to do something to self regulate ourselves starting with the dealers and manufacturers that sell these boats. Ultimately, they are the ones whom the liability will rest upon (training provided or not), and whose very existance will depend on preventing these high performance boats from falling into the wrong hands.
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Old 03-02-2004, 11:35 PM
  #106
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An interesting question to ponder on speed limits for road vehicles...

Since when did people who buy muscle cars obey speed limits? Hell, for that matter, I see Camry's running down the Interstate at 95+.

Speed limits and government intervention are not the answer.

Education and seat time. Nothing like that combination. I think it breeds common sense on the water for the average boater.

That will eliminate a lot of accidents but never all of them. If you look up the definition of accident, you understand you can never eliminate all of them.

accident

\Ac"ci*dent\, n. [F. accident, fr. L. accidens, -dentis, p. pr. of accidere to happen; ad + cadere to fall. See Cadence, Case.] 1. Literally, a befalling; an event that takes place without one's foresight or expectation; an undesigned, sudden, and unexpected event; chance; contingency; often, an undesigned and unforeseen occurrence of an afflictive or unfortunate character; a casualty; a mishap;
 
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Old 03-02-2004, 11:58 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally posted by GLH
Now remind us who you are again??? an elected official with legislative submission powers? No ahh ok then we don't have to worry to much yet.


I know that statement was quite drastic but just trying to prove a point. I love my boat and I love pushing the envelope but I don't like people pushing the envelope when they are endangering others by doing so.

definetly not a and elected official.....I don't think I am capable being that big of an a$$hole.
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:04 AM
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Jromy

Well said. I am gald that someone can articulate what I thought but simply could not produce in writing.
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:35 AM
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I also think it is an issue of common sense and common courtesy. I have taken 3 boating courses (I'm 17) and mainly bass fish on LOTO and don't even consider going out on the lake on weekends because their is to many idiots that don't know what they're doing. Add 40+ ft cruisers that I believe should not be on that narrow of a lake and it's a death trap no matter what boat you have. Last year in front of our house I can remember 6 serious accidents alone and I'm not on the main channel.
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:51 AM
  #110
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Clearcut, if I had children I would reconcider my choice of motorcycles but I think I will always own then. I will also never have children. Everyone has to evaluate their own lives and make decisions accordingly. With a little luck, we get it right now and then.

On the topic of education, it is always a good thing. I can sign up for a street or racing motorcycle school at any number of locations around the country. I dont think there are enough performance boaters to make the percentage that would take a class plausible.
 
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