MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Does anyone here have problems with their MSD ignition systems? After 1-2 years I normally start having problems with my MSD system. Sometimes it’s the distributor that needs to be replaced (the whole thing). Then another thing I have noticed for the marine systems is the ignition box seems to fail every so often as well. For example I have replaced both of these parts twice since first installed in 98. Is this just because it’s on a boat or is it MSD issues?

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

1-2 years sounds about right for the boxes in a marine environment.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

What about like a CraneCams ignition systems?

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Cant answer that, never went to it because the Merc Tbolt IV is about as reliable as anything gets.
What's the reason you need a different ignition?

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have heard of all these msd problems but have never had a 6 box fail and have used them on every thing I have built for past 20 years (probably 15 or 20 different boxes).My msd btm 6 version has been on my boat for over 300 hours and 5 or 6 years with no problems. Steve xsm says they barely last a race but I have had them on circle track cars that we ran for 2 or 3 full seasons and took off and even put on something else. I had 7 box that I bought used that would work intermittently. My msd billet distributer was rotting apart internal after 3 seasons(connections were corroded and crumbling) but my stock merc 502 mpi distributer was too. I cleaned it up,clear coated the rotor and put a new pickup in it fairly cheap. I think water drips off my sun pad directly on it or something,Smitty

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Yeah Junk. I'm Gonna go with the merc ignition. This is my distibutor after one year. Also the havoc the rust cause. Back fire = blown head gasket. :mad:

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/s...d.php?t=127210

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

You can have an MSD distributor rebuilt like brand new for $75. That's getting a brand new distributor for almost the cost of a new cap & rotor! I DO use an MSD Crank Trigger system without relying on the magnetic pick-up from within the distributor---works great for me!

I'm using the Crane M-6 ignition box w/ their PS92 coil. I have had them for 6 years without trouble----one of the boxes was even doused with several gallons of high pressure water the first year----and it STILL is working today!

Here's the address to MSD if you want to send your distributor in and have it come back like brand new...

MSD Ignition Ph: (915) 857-5200
Attn: Repair Dept.
12120 Esther Lama Dr.
Dock #5
Elpaso, TX 79936

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I really dont think its very fair to MSD to be calling thier product junk. They are on almost every race car on the planet, and many boats as well. Considering how many units they have in service, and the environment that they run in, I think the failure rate is pretty small.

Just my opinion,
Bill Koustenis
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Not true. MSD is junk when it comes to so called marine products.

I don't doubt they make a good street product but marine is JUNK from MSD.

trust me after all the money I'm spending to go thru a 800 hp milkshake. You'd be saying they were junk too!

Regards Phil

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

ive never had msd dist or 6a fail on me, i had an msd distrubutor in a jeep of mine that would run even when submerged, i put a bead of silacone around the inside of the dist cap then put it on the dist and let it dry 24 hours before running it. i also use msd spark guard on the dist end and spark plug ends of the ignition wire rubber ends to make those connections water proof. im running crane hi 6 boxes right now cuz they will interact with my knock sensors, but ive had one of my hi six boxes get wet and rev limit that engine to 3k rpms until it dries out :eek: i put some electrical tape over the little timing adjustment knobs until i send it back to crane to be gone through.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I had an MSD 6 in my prior boat, and have one in my current boat also. Zero problems or issues. MSD is the only legal ignition currently allowed in NHRA Pro Stock cars, producing over 1300 HP, turning 9800+ RPM, and running deep in the 6.70 et range, must be doing something right.

Larry

62 Bel-Air 409

260 Eagle XP HP500EFI

2002 Corvette M6 Coupe

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Its weird that some people have never had one fail out of dozens and others have had nothing but failures or is it someone had 1 fail once and now they are a Msd HATER :rolleyes:

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Do NOT charge your batteries with the cables connected with a MSD. You will blow if for sure. You MUST disconnect the cables when you hook up a charger.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I dont think they're junk. They seem to work great in cars, but their failure rate in boats IS a lot higher than the Tbolt ignition.
And unless you're running a big cam or a blower, they dont add anything. So why use it? One more thing to break that your marina doesn't stock.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I better Knock on Wood!! The 6M box in my Cigarette is 12 years old.I did have the distributor rust,but i disassembled it and bead blasted ,then painted all parts.I don't know about every one else, But I do look at the condition of advanced weights yearly because after 10 seasons they did wear out.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I've run Msd in 2 boats over the last 10 years. Both twins. One box has failed. All dists. and coils held up fine. An acceptable record I think.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I do it all the time. never had any problems.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

For a system that doesnt add any useful hp and its only benefits are to cover up idling quality issues or provide high rpm ignition, its quite a success story for their marketing department that so many non-racers are using it. Ive seen more than one race boat having pairs of msd boxes so they could switch when one puked. Having lost an engine myself due to msd timing going heywire, I believe the Crane HI-6 is more reliable and used a couple for years on the formula. That being said, guess what Im using now, T-4's.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

i started with msd stuff when they first started manufacturing. i had some of the prototype 7 series which worked very well. the only failures we had early on were a structural issue where the boards would break loose inside and fall and short. shock mounting the box properly to deal w/ the hi freq vibration that the cars generated fixed that problem. the 6's were a different deal. i never ran them myself as i had crank trigger driven 7's that i was using for other reasons but my customers... dozens and dozens of them started running the 6's because of the hype . and they failed all the time. and there was absolutely no benefit to them that i could quantify either on the dyno or the race track. and when i say " all the time " i mean that every single one of the guys that ran them carried multiple spares. now... the majority of these cars ran no alternator so , as such, maybe they would go to low voltage and the box not like that... or maybe because the batteries were constantly being charged they didn't like THAT or that these guys would occsionally forget the ignition on after downloading their data and it didn't like THAT.... but regardless... on probably 10 occassions i saw cars on the false grid simply fail to start and run and have to go to a back up box to get to run... and dozens and dozens of on track failures... and that simply wasn't good enough for me for a system with nothing going for it anyway.... i pushed my customers to a british system ( not lucas but the name escapes me just now) which put an optical trigger in the distributor and we used any number of stock coils , my favorite being the nissan oil filled ones that were about twice the size of normal, and the failures simply stopped. everybody that bought and carried spares, ended up giving them away when they sold their cars. the optics gave perfect timing accuracy to 9500 and that was the end of that.

i don't think there is any rocket science at all to firing spark plugs when you need to with the correct energy level to get full combustion. i think MSD has discovered that the " zoom" factor and hype can sell a lot of stuff. i am sure that their products, for the most part are at least as well thought out and executed as any other mass produced aftermarket component...

but having said that, would they be my supplier of choice for any component i needed for the boat or any new project ? no... they would not.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

My 20 year old Merk IV with a 60,000 volt coil keeps on ticking for my stroker. Find an older Merc pack withou the rev limiter, you can find one with the right curve for all most applications. I use a 20 top with 12 on the bottom, there are about 8 different ones.

Phil

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have installed MSD systems for as long as they have made them and over the years have had countless failures of every component they make especially in the marine market. On my marine applications I switched or to the Crane systems as soon as they were available and with about 25 installed have yet to have a problem or a complaint from any of my customers and run them on my personal boat. After I installed the first systems I posted them on this site and every time somebody would talk on here about buying MSD for there boat I would try to steer them in the right direction but back then nobody would listen. Look at it this way they have been out for at least 4 years and I still have not heard 1 complaint or of even 1 failure on any of the boating sites that speaks for itself. It is the only system I will sell or install period unless something better comes along. Here is another thought MSD is analog and Crane is digital but I have word that MSD went digital on some of there stuff but do not do business with them anymore as I have enough of there junk on my shelves. The guys that have had good lucky are that lucky. MY 2 cents Brian

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Ive never had any prob with the MSD. On my scarab 12 years on the dist and box and coil. The only thing is see is the side of the dist rusting just like the stock merc on my 500efi.

If I have a prob with the MSD products I just send it back to MSD and they have allways warrented it,just ask nicely :drink: I have there stuff on 5 motors right now.


Rob

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Rob again you had your problems fixed I have had MSD components fail on my own boats on 3 occasions while in the middle of Lake Erie and had to idle back on 1 motor it got to the point that I kept 1 of everything on the boat including all the necessary tools to fix and diagnosis the problems with the ignition system including a timing light. After the 2nd year with the Crane systems I lightened the boat up by 100lbs so that would make the Crane system faster "bonus" and I never have on the back of my mind is the system going to fail today and if it does hope it does not hurt my motors. We need to start a thread on Crane system failures and see what comes up as I have yet to see any. To me a day of fun trouble free boating wins hands down over any other hobby I have. Brian

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have a Crane box but just bought a set of MSD distributors.

Which Distributor do you use Brian?

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Brian, I like the Crane HI-6M ignition box too! Not sure if I clarified that when I bought my boat it already had the MSD billet distributors w/MSD ignition boxes, but had all kinds of trouble with the system so, I added the MSD Crank Trigger system and switched to a Crane Hi-6M ignition box w/PS92 coil while still retaining the MSD distributors. That was SIX-6 years ago---still no problems! And as I have said earlier, one of the Crane ignition boxes was even drenched with several gallons of high pressure water in 2001----still working today!

By the way, I still think sending your MSD distributor(s) in to their Repair Department every year for a total rebuild at $75 each is hard to argue with---that is I suppose unless it fails you by having corroded so fast during the boating season while you're boating out in the middle of the water somewhere!

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have had no problem with MSD my self, I run the offroad box , If it can with stand the abuse of a mudder it will work fine in a boat. It may not be approved but I could not find any differences to the 6m2 except approval. But I have seen friends have trouble and lots of trouble trying to use the 6al , but they are being cheap and look where it got them, BROKE, buying another.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

2112 I use the stock Merc distributors and re clock the rotor as per the instructions but instead of drilling the new holes I use a Whitney punch but made a pattern out of an old rotor so I can duplicate the in about 1 minute. The cap and rotor are the only spare parts I keep on the boat now and you can get them anywhere not like trying to find MSD parts on the weekend.I made spare rotors for all my customers to keep on their boats but nobody has used them yet.

Kaama I thing the MSD distributors are the weakest part due to the rust issues but then again you are using crank triggers but I have had constant problems with their caps in the marine invirment for years. The only issues I have ever had with Merc distributors are the lower bushings and gears but they are easy to check just by taking of the cap every year and checking the play in the rotor. Again LOVE them and in the mid 400 to 600 HP range to me there is no other option.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have never had a prob on the boats. But the hevelle had the advance wear out one time and one of the race cars it broke a roll pin on the dist gear .one coil on the chevelle went out. I have never had a box go out .Lucky I guess???

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Kaama,

Any trouble with mounting the ignition directly on the bellhousing? THe Crane manual advises not to. I have done it and wondered if I was just lucky not to have trouble.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I also do not mount to engine electronics are happier away from heat and vibration.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I mounted mine to a large piece of alum angle back on the transom. away from heat and water. I do have a problem with the stock merc rotor comming loose . I buy new every year locktite them on like the manual says and they shake them selves loose. I can tell when they are loose the tack goes wackie. Thinking about MSD dist.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I must be lucky too because so far I have 50 hours on my Crane boxes mounted this way---no problems yet and I guess we'll find out.

I'm not sure if it helps or not, but the boxes are mounted on rubber mounts. Also, I have Harwood engine hatch scoops that are constantly introducing cool air into the engine compartment.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Seen to many MSD failures to put them in my boat.
Merc T-bolt distributor and Ford DG-3 50,000 volt coil work just fine :cool:
Have been tossing around the Crane idea though. So far I haven't heard anything bad.

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

merc ignition v6 module and to keep plugs clean msd blue 6al box

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Like I posted earlier,I have a msd 6btm box thats been on my boat since 01 with no problems. Unlike some who think it does nothing over a stock ignition,it does multi- spark with more power than stock under 3000rpm's and cleaned up a sputtery idle/rich idle and fires all the extra fuel mixture being shoved into motor under boost and extreme conditions. Is it as reliable as a stock system, I highly doubt it. If I had a bone stock 502 I wouldn't waste my money,it would offer nothing other than one more thing to break. Would I run a bone stock factory ignition on a 950 hp blower motor like what I have ,no way.
These failures in a marine enviroment,are they regular 6al's or marine versions? It has got to be vibration and shock loosening things up inside the box or something. I have bought and ran 6al boxes on at least 20 different street vehicles and circle track cars that I have owned or built for others with no failures. Old Navy on here put a non-marine 6al on his old jet boat (before his 28 ft check) and it didn't last a year. It was mounted to the motor though.You can see it in this pic. Mine is mounted on shock mounts on the gunnell of to my stbd side.Anyone that had one fail that reads this that already posted re-post and tell us where it was mounted. I believe you guys are having them fail,I just wonder if its shock and vibration or poor quality control when they were built,Smitty

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I have been through MANY MSD failures and spoke with MSD about the problems with the MARINE box and was finally told to install P/N 8830 on all MARINE boxes and I have yet to have a failure since using this part on the boxes.
If you buy a CRANE HI-6M it will come with a filter from the factory, so if you buy a CRANE MARINE box don't discard this part (USE IT).
This is a voltage CAP and it absorbs the voltage spikes that boats usually produce from having bad grounds and connections. Not to mention all the pounding that agitates this problem.
Hope this helps!

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Well my boat wouldn't start yesterday morning, and my wife was bringing 3 of her girlfriends, talk about a major crisis :eek:

Tach wasn't moving when cranking so I went to the MSD box. Good power and ground, good ignition signal. So I hooked up my old msd box and it fired right up.

Got to looking at the pins in the 6 pin weather pac connector thinking that one might have slid back and instead saw that they were all corroded!WTF.

Cleaned all the pins best I could then greased them with di-electric grease and reinstalled the origional 6M2 box and it fired right up.

I used weather pac connectors every where I could when I re-rigged the boat thinking they were the best. This week I will be disasembleing all of them for cleaning and di-electric grease.

I only got religious about di-electric grease in the past two years and use it everywhere, never thought about the weather pacs.

Took about an hour for me and my buddy to figure it out and fix it. I wonder how many more MSD problems are due to this issue :rolleyes:

Went boating and had a great time, even saw some tities. :drink:

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Wobble,
Pics are required in this situation! And not of the weather packs...

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

Agreed! :drink:

Re: MSD Marine ignition problems!!!!!! MSD = total junk?
 

I just bought a new boat . Full msd system previously installed. How much advance should come from the 6-m box ?