Jetting/tuning For Procharger setup
#51
Guest
Posts: n/a
Thanks for the input guys.
I haven't been able to do a full throttle chop yet either so it may be lean right up on top (!!). I will definitely check this weekend.
Turbojack - on the regulator issue I have to admit that I f@cked up there because I was thinking about when I initially had the boost referenced off a port UNDER the carb. (this is where I have my boost gauge now). Because that location actually generates vacuum at idle, I was getting a drop in fuel pressure with the engine idling (since the Aeromotive Reg. actually works both ways), but I realize now that the pressure is now at 7.5 lbs at idle (since I'm now referencing the reg off the box).
It is definitely pegging the 15lb. fuel pressure gauge at full boost though (and doesn't fluctuate at all), so I still think it might be flooding.
Thanks for the advice on the timing. Seems the general consensus is 30 deg. timing advance.
Later...
I haven't been able to do a full throttle chop yet either so it may be lean right up on top (!!). I will definitely check this weekend.
Turbojack - on the regulator issue I have to admit that I f@cked up there because I was thinking about when I initially had the boost referenced off a port UNDER the carb. (this is where I have my boost gauge now). Because that location actually generates vacuum at idle, I was getting a drop in fuel pressure with the engine idling (since the Aeromotive Reg. actually works both ways), but I realize now that the pressure is now at 7.5 lbs at idle (since I'm now referencing the reg off the box).
It is definitely pegging the 15lb. fuel pressure gauge at full boost though (and doesn't fluctuate at all), so I still think it might be flooding.
Thanks for the advice on the timing. Seems the general consensus is 30 deg. timing advance.
Later...
#52
nordicheat hey this is james from jax. FL. just finshed up with my fast system i would like too look at your base and send you what i have thanks james [email protected]
#53
Guest
Posts: n/a
Update:
Changed jetting back to #90s on all 4 corners.
Checked float level & set at slightly above (1/6-1/8") bottom of hole for both bowls.
Turned fuel pressure down to 6 lbs. at idle.
Left max. timing @ 28 degrees BTC.
Installed a 34pitch labbed Bravo 1.
Ran it and noticed a lean sneeze during part throttle acceleration so changed secondary squirter to a # 42 (which cured the problem).
Ran it up to 100mph in about 3/4 mile and had to chop throttle because was running into a cross-wind and trimmed up and boat started to lift too much. Still felt like it was laying down on top so I decided to change prop to really see what was going on.
Changed fuel press. back to 7.5 @ idle to be safe and installed 29" "Accelerator".
Ran it again for about a mile and held it down and the GPS wouldn't't go over 94mph and it kept "bucking" like it was running out of fuel - like stalling for a few seconds
and then catching back. I finally shut it down just cut it off and checked the plugs - and they are LEAN! Like bleach-white insulator lean. I had my brother in the boat and he kept his eye on the fuel press and says it was pegged - steady- at 15+lbs. I think this all confirms my suspicions - the carb is drying out the bowls and the motor goes so lean it stalls momentarily (thankfully, too lean, too suddenly to "lean out!).
The reason it's more noticeable with the smaller prop is because it's accelerating and revving harder. I think it's the needle and seat assembly (.110" - I believe) not being able to keep up with the flow of two #90 jets (each has a .1055" orifice) as well as the two Power Valve orifices which look like around .080 ". Even though the fuel is flowing at 15 lbs (10lbs effectively @5lbs of boost) at the needle, it still can't flow enough.
I'm ordering some .150" needles and seats shortly. This is the biggest they make so hopefully it will be enough.
I keep you all posted.
Changed jetting back to #90s on all 4 corners.
Checked float level & set at slightly above (1/6-1/8") bottom of hole for both bowls.
Turned fuel pressure down to 6 lbs. at idle.
Left max. timing @ 28 degrees BTC.
Installed a 34pitch labbed Bravo 1.
Ran it and noticed a lean sneeze during part throttle acceleration so changed secondary squirter to a # 42 (which cured the problem).
Ran it up to 100mph in about 3/4 mile and had to chop throttle because was running into a cross-wind and trimmed up and boat started to lift too much. Still felt like it was laying down on top so I decided to change prop to really see what was going on.
Changed fuel press. back to 7.5 @ idle to be safe and installed 29" "Accelerator".
Ran it again for about a mile and held it down and the GPS wouldn't't go over 94mph and it kept "bucking" like it was running out of fuel - like stalling for a few seconds
and then catching back. I finally shut it down just cut it off and checked the plugs - and they are LEAN! Like bleach-white insulator lean. I had my brother in the boat and he kept his eye on the fuel press and says it was pegged - steady- at 15+lbs. I think this all confirms my suspicions - the carb is drying out the bowls and the motor goes so lean it stalls momentarily (thankfully, too lean, too suddenly to "lean out!).
The reason it's more noticeable with the smaller prop is because it's accelerating and revving harder. I think it's the needle and seat assembly (.110" - I believe) not being able to keep up with the flow of two #90 jets (each has a .1055" orifice) as well as the two Power Valve orifices which look like around .080 ". Even though the fuel is flowing at 15 lbs (10lbs effectively @5lbs of boost) at the needle, it still can't flow enough.
I'm ordering some .150" needles and seats shortly. This is the biggest they make so hopefully it will be enough.
I keep you all posted.
#55
Guest
Posts: n/a
I have the Aeromotive A1000 Pump plumbed with -8 hose and I have a Aeromotive Carb Bypass Regulator w/ boost reference port. According to what I've read, this pump is good for between 1,000 and 1,300 hp depending on whether you're injected or carbed. I'm pretty sure it'll keep up with the biggest needle and seat. BTW: I've just ordered a set of .150" Titanium needle assemblies from Summit Racing. Hopefully I'll get them this week so I can test again this weekend.
#56
Is your pressure gauge on the regulator or at the carb? Are you running 1 or 2 lines from the regulator to the carb? If gauge is at regulator & only single line to carb maybe you do have 15lbs at the regulator but not at the carb.
#58
Guest
Posts: n/a
My pressure gauge reads off the Regulator which is connected via a single 8" long -8AN hose to the connector on the Vortech box (yep - that's my bastard setup!) which then tees inside the box to 2 -6AN hard lines into the carb inlets (this is all part of the Vortech box setup). I don't see how the pressure could be dropping there though, because there is really no restriction between the regulator and the box and the carb inlets and, after all, all of the fuel is still only going through those tiny little .110" needles into the carb. I can move the gauge fitting from the Reg. to the fitting on the carb box and that would move it downstream about 8 inches so that if there is a restriction between the reg. and the bulkhead fitting on the box, I would know.
BTW: Has anybody tested the difference between the Vortech and the Procharger box? (The Vortech box looks like it might have a restriction where the tube flows into the box) Or either one and a carb hat or pipe? I'm starting to think that this whole carb box deal is more trouble than it's worth. It's certainly a pain in the A$$ to change jets! Why don't they make them so that the lid is deeper than the bottom so you can easily get at the float bowls without pulling the carb out of the box?
BTW: Has anybody tested the difference between the Vortech and the Procharger box? (The Vortech box looks like it might have a restriction where the tube flows into the box) Or either one and a carb hat or pipe? I'm starting to think that this whole carb box deal is more trouble than it's worth. It's certainly a pain in the A$$ to change jets! Why don't they make them so that the lid is deeper than the bottom so you can easily get at the float bowls without pulling the carb out of the box?
#59
Registered
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,519
Likes: 31
I flow tested a Vortech carb box when I started designing the supercooler. For comparison I flowed a 750 carb on a Superflow 600 flow bench. All numbers are reported at 28" H2O.
1000 CFM - carb in box without lid
643 CFM - carb in box with lid and pipes (2@90s)
545 CFM - carb in box with lid, pipes and intercooler
That's right, the plumbing to connect the blower to the intercooler and carb costs you that much airflow, more if you are using more than 2@90s. We never think about this because the blower overcomes the restriction and we get a overall increase in performance.
The supercooler carb/ intercooler box flows 735 CFM as opposed to 545 CFM and this adds about 90 HP without touching the blower pulley.
I haven't tested the Procharger box but based on the similar geometry I wouldn't expect it to be any better.
I also don't like the fuel line plumbing on the Vortech box. Every fitting increases restriction and reduces the max flow available. I think it makes sense to keep the two lines provided out of the regulator separate all the way to the fuel bowls. I tried to use the Vortech fittings in the supercooler but they interefered with air flow.
1000 CFM - carb in box without lid
643 CFM - carb in box with lid and pipes (2@90s)
545 CFM - carb in box with lid, pipes and intercooler
That's right, the plumbing to connect the blower to the intercooler and carb costs you that much airflow, more if you are using more than 2@90s. We never think about this because the blower overcomes the restriction and we get a overall increase in performance.
The supercooler carb/ intercooler box flows 735 CFM as opposed to 545 CFM and this adds about 90 HP without touching the blower pulley.
I haven't tested the Procharger box but based on the similar geometry I wouldn't expect it to be any better.
I also don't like the fuel line plumbing on the Vortech box. Every fitting increases restriction and reduces the max flow available. I think it makes sense to keep the two lines provided out of the regulator separate all the way to the fuel bowls. I tried to use the Vortech fittings in the supercooler but they interefered with air flow.
#60
Registered
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 487
Likes: 0
From: Murray,KY
I am looking at a Holley book by Mike Urich and it says 110 seat with a window(not holes)flows 295 lb /hr @ 6 psi. I've read elsewhere it takes .7 lb/hp for supercharged setup. That's support for 842 HP if you have 6 psi at the carb. As fast as you are you are prob right there.



