Ok maybe a different way........
10-17-2007, 02:13 PM
#41
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The one thing to think about is....you can't take a old 27 foot whatever type of boat and put in a 500 hp in it and someone go out and buy a new 27 activator with a 500 and expect us both run deck to deck....
OSS did the spec class racing....and so did SBI/APBA....but the biggest class's are in Bracket racing....
The question should be...even in the smaller boats like F1...why will teams not even make the small investment in the F1 Class Brian was trying to start.....simple....no one wanted to make the investment into the engines....plus these guys know there old boats will not be competitive to the newer hull designs....
and lets say 20 boats did do this and put in say a 500 hp and 1 weight, 1 gear, and a set X, and you go out and you are no were near being compeditive to the newer boats.....you will not continue to race and get your butts kicked....
You will find yourself going back to braket racing....
But again....even in 3 to 4 footers...how many smaller boats are holding back from braking out...
Today you have over 14 Class 5 boats and over 15 class 4 boats racing....throw in the class 6 boats and you have over 42 boats just in OPA.....and in just those 3 classes....anybody you has a performance boat under 36 feet can race today in one of those classes....
We all want the sport to grow but what is the most likely way to get more boats out....
Make a class that will have limited racers that can afford to join in or make it easier for a racer to get into racing without spending a lot of money and have low overhead cost to race and still be competitive...
It all sound great to talk about how great a class will be if we do this and that and how great then the sport will be....its a hole differant animal to make it happen....
Brian...you invested a lot of time and money into putting the F1 Class back together....
What were the biggest obsticals you had to overcome to make it work....
I think you had the passion....the game plan....the idea...the marketing....the prize money.....so I don't think it was you why it never got off the ground....it was the racers who did not want to make the move and investment.....
Its easier to tweek something that is already working to make things better....then to start something new again from the ground up.....
OSS did the spec class racing....and so did SBI/APBA....but the biggest class's are in Bracket racing....
The question should be...even in the smaller boats like F1...why will teams not even make the small investment in the F1 Class Brian was trying to start.....simple....no one wanted to make the investment into the engines....plus these guys know there old boats will not be competitive to the newer hull designs....
and lets say 20 boats did do this and put in say a 500 hp and 1 weight, 1 gear, and a set X, and you go out and you are no were near being compeditive to the newer boats.....you will not continue to race and get your butts kicked....
You will find yourself going back to braket racing....
But again....even in 3 to 4 footers...how many smaller boats are holding back from braking out...
Today you have over 14 Class 5 boats and over 15 class 4 boats racing....throw in the class 6 boats and you have over 42 boats just in OPA.....and in just those 3 classes....anybody you has a performance boat under 36 feet can race today in one of those classes....
We all want the sport to grow but what is the most likely way to get more boats out....
Make a class that will have limited racers that can afford to join in or make it easier for a racer to get into racing without spending a lot of money and have low overhead cost to race and still be competitive...
It all sound great to talk about how great a class will be if we do this and that and how great then the sport will be....its a hole differant animal to make it happen....
Brian...you invested a lot of time and money into putting the F1 Class back together....
What were the biggest obsticals you had to overcome to make it work....
I think you had the passion....the game plan....the idea...the marketing....the prize money.....so I don't think it was you why it never got off the ground....it was the racers who did not want to make the move and investment.....
Its easier to tweek something that is already working to make things better....then to start something new again from the ground up.....
Last edited by MANITIE; 10-17-2007 at 02:43 PM.
10-17-2007, 03:21 PM
#42
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Gino,
The most enjoyment I got out of racing was trying to beat the Activator. Before the 525 came along and screwed everything up, I put a new driver in for Key West. Low and behold I found out we could turn inside that little hot rod. No we didn't win that year, we took 3rd, but we were close and kept getting better. This is what spec class racing is all about.
You pushed it, I pushed it and sometimes we got thrown out for pushing to hard. (PROPCO). The Activator success came from a very good team that was anal about testing and setup. A lesser team would have not done as well. Spec class racing is about the people in the boat not the GPS.
Class racing has brought racers back out. If we want F1 back, we're going to have to get off our collective butts and do something about it. Time for a F1 grudge match! Then we can go run Class 5. Imagine, 2 races in one weekend. Who has the nastiest water?
J
The most enjoyment I got out of racing was trying to beat the Activator. Before the 525 came along and screwed everything up, I put a new driver in for Key West. Low and behold I found out we could turn inside that little hot rod. No we didn't win that year, we took 3rd, but we were close and kept getting better. This is what spec class racing is all about.
You pushed it, I pushed it and sometimes we got thrown out for pushing to hard. (PROPCO). The Activator success came from a very good team that was anal about testing and setup. A lesser team would have not done as well. Spec class racing is about the people in the boat not the GPS.
Class racing has brought racers back out. If we want F1 back, we're going to have to get off our collective butts and do something about it. Time for a F1 grudge match! Then we can go run Class 5. Imagine, 2 races in one weekend. Who has the nastiest water?
J
10-17-2007, 04:02 PM
#43
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Gino:
Points well taken. I think the hardest obstacle I had was racers believing in me and the engine issue. I got fed up when I couldn't get any return phone calls. To be honest you and Candy not getting along sealed my faith. You guy's were going to be my stars. I think now we can atleast look ahead and try to tip toe w/ this idea and atleast come to some solution. The engine builders are back in the sport and they should be. I honestly think any engine builder should be able to build a low cost , 500 ish hp engine that will last and run the whole year. It would be easy on Bravo's and our pocketbook. I have nothing against OPA / SBI or any racing org. I just refuse to build up a 700+ hp engine to do the GPS thing. Hey I throttled Tyler's boat after the race Sunday and that boat was well within the rules for the class but let me tell you right now that that is the quickest rocket up to 69 mph that my redneck a s s has ever been in. The reason I brought the spec racing back up is because I have a customer that's wanting to get back in the sport and If it comes to fruition I'll be running the boat some w/ him. Let's keep this idea going and maybe Tyler , Innovation , JCPERF or a reputable engine builder will step up w/ an affordable engine package , a deal that we can't refuse. I need a 500 efi / comparable engine right now. Thanks to all of the positive feedback!
Points well taken. I think the hardest obstacle I had was racers believing in me and the engine issue. I got fed up when I couldn't get any return phone calls. To be honest you and Candy not getting along sealed my faith. You guy's were going to be my stars. I think now we can atleast look ahead and try to tip toe w/ this idea and atleast come to some solution. The engine builders are back in the sport and they should be. I honestly think any engine builder should be able to build a low cost , 500 ish hp engine that will last and run the whole year. It would be easy on Bravo's and our pocketbook. I have nothing against OPA / SBI or any racing org. I just refuse to build up a 700+ hp engine to do the GPS thing. Hey I throttled Tyler's boat after the race Sunday and that boat was well within the rules for the class but let me tell you right now that that is the quickest rocket up to 69 mph that my redneck a s s has ever been in. The reason I brought the spec racing back up is because I have a customer that's wanting to get back in the sport and If it comes to fruition I'll be running the boat some w/ him. Let's keep this idea going and maybe Tyler , Innovation , JCPERF or a reputable engine builder will step up w/ an affordable engine package , a deal that we can't refuse. I need a 500 efi / comparable engine right now. Thanks to all of the positive feedback!
10-17-2007, 06:51 PM
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We built our boat to SVL spec but chose to run OPA this season to get some seat time racing. At first we didnt think we could be competative against big hp twins etc. but we proved ourselves wrong. We had such a blast with OPA we plan to run all of next season with them! Chattanooga was the worst finish we had all season but we felt it was the best we raced. We closed the gap on Simmons and Simply Awesome (even got ahead of them for a bit) and avoided a few near hits! We took the turns harder than ever and ran the boat for all it had. Nobody in 4 class had much of a chance against the yellow phantom with 800hp unless they made a huge mistake or broke out. I would have to say that they have stepped the class up for next season. I Know we will make the changes we need to run them down. Iam sure anyone else in 4 class that wants a chance at the checkered will do the same. If they dont want to spend the money/time they can always move down to 5 class. I dont feel OPA should make any changes keep it simple it works and its fun! We just need to understand that competative people will always step something up no matter what the class or expense. If it was a spec class we would be spending the money on hulls instead of motors.
Scott
TEAM OCATNE 411
FUTURE CLASS 400 CHAMPIONS 2008
Scott
TEAM OCATNE 411
FUTURE CLASS 400 CHAMPIONS 2008
10-17-2007, 06:53 PM
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I would love to see some equal racing come back..loved F1,it did get a little expensive however is it not possible to reassign a spec P series class,using existing boats..one engine,weight,two drives or one per old f1 type setup,
I for one think it can be done...there is bunches of this stuff still around.When everything changed to a 500 EFI we still ran a 500 carb,they said it couldnt be done we had a blast racing with BJ and the Activator,and many others like Phantoms etc....there was many a close race..
It came down to prop,driver and throttles as factor as well as weight and fuel required at WOT,dont lift..lol..
Cant you split this class of racing between some ocean and calmer water race sites,some hulls new or old may benefit in various water conditions,evrything changes water wise but there are some sites that have a goodenough history to make a fairt call on....it would give a fair chance in varying conditions..maybe the series for this class only ran in 4 0r 5 races instead of all within the existing clubs,hopefully this would not require them to change anything thye are currently doing....if you wanted to run something else have at it..there was a great amountt of helping each other even in factory racing,we all justed wanted boats out there to run with.
I dont really care myself about prize money,it was the thrill of being out there with equal boats and lots of them..,I have yet to figure out how the p series or old f1 series could cover race expenses,sure it would help,but we still find different ways to blow the money anyway..its part of the sport..
I cant understand how blowing a motor because its such high torque and hp cant be more expensive or the same as a set motor such as a 500 efi,especially since there seem to be a few around..and more then one builder qualified..
maybe try again to see if we cant among ourselves get 3-5 teams to try it and police our selves to see where we can take it..
I am open to trying..
I for one think it can be done...there is bunches of this stuff still around.When everything changed to a 500 EFI we still ran a 500 carb,they said it couldnt be done we had a blast racing with BJ and the Activator,and many others like Phantoms etc....there was many a close race..
It came down to prop,driver and throttles as factor as well as weight and fuel required at WOT,dont lift..lol..
Cant you split this class of racing between some ocean and calmer water race sites,some hulls new or old may benefit in various water conditions,evrything changes water wise but there are some sites that have a goodenough history to make a fairt call on....it would give a fair chance in varying conditions..maybe the series for this class only ran in 4 0r 5 races instead of all within the existing clubs,hopefully this would not require them to change anything thye are currently doing....if you wanted to run something else have at it..there was a great amountt of helping each other even in factory racing,we all justed wanted boats out there to run with.
I dont really care myself about prize money,it was the thrill of being out there with equal boats and lots of them..,I have yet to figure out how the p series or old f1 series could cover race expenses,sure it would help,but we still find different ways to blow the money anyway..its part of the sport..
I cant understand how blowing a motor because its such high torque and hp cant be more expensive or the same as a set motor such as a 500 efi,especially since there seem to be a few around..and more then one builder qualified..
maybe try again to see if we cant among ourselves get 3-5 teams to try it and police our selves to see where we can take it..
I am open to trying..
10-17-2007, 07:23 PM
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10-17-2007, 07:41 PM
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I found this on the web from the good ole days!
FACTORY 1 CLASS
Class Designation: F1-
Boat: Single engine inboard V-bottoms
Length: 24 to 29 feet
Weight: 4100 to 4975 lb (depending on length and engine)
Description: Factory production V-bottom boats with factory production engines and drives. No modifications are allowed except for minor changes to interiors and seats. Concept is "Ski on Saturday...Race on Sunday"
Speed: Estimated straightaway speed is 80 mph on calm water
Engines: (spec class) single Mercury Racing HP500 or HP500 EFI only
Drives: MerCruiser Bravo stern drives
Cost: Estimated $80,000 to $100,000
FACTORY 1 CLASS
Class Designation: F1-
Boat: Single engine inboard V-bottoms
Length: 24 to 29 feet
Weight: 4100 to 4975 lb (depending on length and engine)
Description: Factory production V-bottom boats with factory production engines and drives. No modifications are allowed except for minor changes to interiors and seats. Concept is "Ski on Saturday...Race on Sunday"
Speed: Estimated straightaway speed is 80 mph on calm water
Engines: (spec class) single Mercury Racing HP500 or HP500 EFI only
Drives: MerCruiser Bravo stern drives
Cost: Estimated $80,000 to $100,000
