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353 Deck/Hull bond? Anyone have a loose rub-rail

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353 Deck/Hull bond? Anyone have a loose rub-rail

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Old 11-09-2016, 10:05 AM
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Default 353 Deck/Hull bond? Anyone have a loose rub-rail

Guys,

Has anyone had to re-bond the deck to the hull on their 353's? Took my rub-rail off and found all of the holes in the mid-section of the boat to be oversized and torn up. Upon looking closer, I found that the deck was moving if I pulled on the run rail. Looking from the outside I can now see into the boat. What I also noticed was that beginning at the rear of the windshield there is a structural bar that is thru bolted from the outside (no movement there). Also forward of the Large hatch, there are blind bolts that attached into the cabin. For about 14 ft in the mid section (hatch to rear of windshield) there are no thru bolts or structure to mount to. The issue exists on both side of the boat.

Formula used plex to bond the deck to the hull, the plex on my boat is non existent for the most part and have nothing left to bond the two together. My rub-rail bolts are all that were holding them.

Looking for the best option, Formula will help with providing the applicator as I can buy the material direct from them at a good price.

Has anyone attempted to rebond them or done any repair like this? I'd bet 5200 could do as good or better since it is more compliant and holds insanely well? The Plex seems to be a hard and brittle material and is unknown to me (heard 7 min work time)?

Thanks,

Eric
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Old 11-09-2016, 10:58 AM
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OSO members have posted on this before with the fix, there was a long thread on it Ill try to search for it. This is not the first Formula, usually 382s, to have this issue but it is fixable, really crappy about the minimal thru bolts.


Here you go

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/f...k-bonding.html

Last edited by VoodooRob; 11-09-2016 at 11:00 AM.
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Old 11-09-2016, 11:28 AM
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Eric,

Sorry to hear about your troubles. May I suggest contacting Dave Sikorski (Glassdave). Dave did all the repairs on my boat and I know for fact went thru every inch of ours from bow to stern...he maybe able to give you some real professional insight that may help... The thread the VOODOO shared has a ton of good information in it also.

Good luck,

Chris
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Old 11-09-2016, 12:02 PM
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Thx Guys,

Sent a note to Glassdave.

When I talked to Formula I was told it was not uncommon for this issue to occur. Just need to clean out the old stuff and reapply, a DIY project. Would like to work with materials I know have the strength required, but ease of working with it.
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Old 11-09-2016, 08:21 PM
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IMO either Plexus or 5200 are both good options. Plexus is a very different bond then what you will get with 5200 and if done PROPERLY is a lifetime bond. There are plexus products that can give you up to 90 min of work time. The stuff I used for my engine bay repair gave a lot of work time. If you look at that thread I had the model number of the adhesive. The other issue with the Plexus is the need for a special gun to use it. Not a cheap thing to have to buy. 5200 is easy as well, bonds like crazy and only requires a standard caulking gun.
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Old 11-10-2016, 09:22 AM
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Great info!

Formula will provide the gun if I buy the product from them, just need to return it.

Was wondering how to prep the surfaces for Plexus? Do I need to separate the deck completely? Or do I scrape what I can and jam a rag and some solvent up there as best I can?

My only concerns with 5200 is that it is runny and may be difficult to fill larger gaps.

I would like to thru bolt in the area, but would like to understand why Formula didn't do that. Makes no sense to me. In 14 ft, no thru bolts and only dabs (not a bead) of Plexus? I don't want to creat a stress riser, seems odd to me.
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Old 11-10-2016, 12:34 PM
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Jriggs and I did this repair on our boats with the tools supplied by Formula. It's a very easy job.
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Old 11-14-2016, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by snowrunner View Post
Great info!

Formula will provide the gun if I buy the product from them, just need to return it.

Was wondering how to prep the surfaces for Plexus? Do I need to separate the deck completely? Or do I scrape what I can and jam a rag and some solvent up there as best I can?

My only concerns with 5200 is that it is runny and may be difficult to fill larger gaps.

I would like to thru bolt in the area, but would like to understand why Formula didn't do that. Makes no sense to me. In 14 ft, no thru bolts and only dabs (not a bead) of Plexus? I don't want to creat a stress riser, seems odd to me.
Prep: you should get ALL the plexus out that you can. That is the hard part! Take a look at the two threads for the bottom repairs that are up. The stuff really sucks to get out. I have no idea how you could get it out between the two hull halfs? Sanding does not really work well unless you can keep your disc speeds very slow. Plexus does not like to bond to itself. Once you get it all out then clean it as best you can. Plexus is not the same as a glue. It cross links into the surfaces. It uses heat caused by the chemical reaction to do this. You do not want to squeeze it all out, pay very close attention to the minimum thickness. I seem to recall them telling me about the thickness of a wooden match. Once the work time is up you do not want to move it at all. Moving it weakens the bond.

I did my old boat with 5200. It does run out and makes a mess but it was cheap and holds like crazy. I taped and papered the entire side of the boat. It made clean up very easy. I would think that no matter what way you go you will have a permanent solution.
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Old 11-15-2016, 07:00 AM
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Funny,

The easy part thus far was getting the plexus out. It was brittle and basically fell out by itself. Filed a putty knife to a razor edge, set a wedge between the deck and hull, and was able to easily scrape or chip the rest off. The material was still in bead form, as if it were just applied like caulk - looked like long skinny tootsie roll that was rock hard. I don't think it bonded at all.

The material I will be getting is Plexus MA2045. Looks like it fills from 0.03-2", big range. The tech specs indicate no real prep is required. Will try to get some acetone wiped in there somehow.

Plan to also hit it with 5200 once the Plexus has cured wherever there are gaps hull/deck. This is one of the easier jobs I will be doing this winter, I hope - LOL


I would suggest that anyone with a loose rub, remove a portion and inspect - this is likely an issue with the Plexus used back in the day.

Thanks for the write-up, definitely make me more confident that this issue can be remedied fairly easily.

Last edited by snowrunner; 11-15-2016 at 07:03 AM.
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Old 11-16-2016, 07:56 AM
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You want to at least clean it with acetone. If you can get in there with sand paper or grinder even better. If you look at my engine bay project you will see I did some test pulls with no cleaning, wiping down and grinding and cleaning. The difference between just cleaning and grinding and cleaning was significant. Also make sure the 2 mating surfaces are warm. The warmer your shop the better. They do not recommend doing it in a cold shop. If your are chipping off like that then consider yourself lucky. What Dave and I had to do to get it out of our boats are nothing short of a nightmare, even were it was just a bead because of no compression. Also pay close attention to your work and clamp times. Once your work time is over stop and make sure the parts do not move at all. Any movement will weaken the bond. Good luck. It is not hard just get everything ready and fallow the steps and recommendations and it will be better then new! I think I have to do it on mine as well. Got to finish the engine bay first. May put it off tell next year.
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