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63' Bertram Possibly stuffed off SC???

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Old 01-14-2010, 08:55 PM
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Now the way it is done the gougon brothers have a Hydro mat testing rig a Panel is placed in side and water pressure is used for evaluation and pressures noted they have ABS approval I think also problem is the Plastic cores defeat the test rig once in a while like the simple drop hammer.
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Old 01-14-2010, 09:04 PM
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My theory on the transom is just a theory, but when the foredeck failed and delaminated, all of that water was forced through the lazzarette and lower bilge and exited at the transom, basicly blowing it clear off the back of the boat. The transoms are designed to take forces from behind, (backing down) but i doubt anybody thought about thousands of gallons being forced through at 25+ knots pushing outward.
Exactly! I agree completely.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:17 PM
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Now the way it is done the gougon brothers have a Hydro mat testing rig a Panel is placed in side and water pressure is used for evaluation and pressures noted they have ABS approval I think also problem is the Plastic cores defeat the test rig once in a while like the simple drop hammer.
I posted 3 pieces of data.

all bogus?

UD

PS: Still waiting for #'s
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:55 PM
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I posted 3 pieces of data.

all bogus?

UD

PS: Still waiting for #'s
You have ASTM numbers that are meaning less with a resilient foam system! The way it is done is with actual panel testing in the Hydromat test rig! You have a hard time understanding the basics here where this sophicated material is involved!

and how do you explain the failure in the laboratory testing where the D-100 failed instantly and the A-600 threw the hammer back!

Still waiting on an explanation why the wood failed you are up!
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:58 PM
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Uncle here:http://composite.about.com/library/P...blgrpguru1.htm
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:37 PM
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uncle your numbers are fine for the brittle materials where they fail when loaded but with Ductile/Resilient they are not in the ball park

we are talking Glass like Brittle materials like the orginal Foam which was Pvc modified with Isocyanates Divinny Cell ,Kledgecell which given to the French as war reparations from Germany after WW11 it was even in the Bismark are part of this formula!! then a second generation was done straight PVC this time with nitrogen in the melt the embryo was grown in a autoclave this was Airex .

(the first generation was grown in a deep water tank)

Airex then was cut and normalized in a oven it had Cobolt sprayed on it in the old days to aid in the resin cure on the hot coat process..Now comes the third generation: Core Cell which is state of the art a wide range of densities and all the approvals each sheet is stamped But You can't use testing methods used on building material on this Kind of a core material.

The mentality here is we have a steel flat bar clamped in a bench vise and we apply a load and graph this you would see the graph climb like straight up then the steel will bend a little so the line on our graph is now going to the horizontal and that would be marked as ultimate strength!! wrong we keep pulling and the bar is bending more and more and the line is going across the grid more horizontal.. like I said Hooks Law is for springy things which is what we want

Now we do this same thing with these brittle things and the line would go up vertical then failure a big X no more load can be applied.

Corecell is costly but a lot of people use it.

Last edited by Steve 1; 01-14-2010 at 11:40 PM.
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:50 PM
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You have ASTM numbers that are meaning less with a resilient foam system! The way it is done is with actual panel testing in the Hydromat test rig! You have a hard time understanding the basics here where this sophicated material is involved!

and how do you explain the failure in the laboratory testing where the D-100 failed instantly and the A-600 threw the hammer back!

Still waiting on an explanation why the wood failed you are up!

Can you go get the data from the guys that make "d100" and a-600 and post it for us to see? pick apples to apples testing standards and lets look at them togther.

Certainly the data from them will show what you claim?.....

Manufacturers links directly to it would be fine.

Skater doesnt know how to build a boat... Schiada....






UD
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:04 AM
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Can you go get the data from the guys that make "d100" and a-600 and post it for us to see? pick apples to apples testing standards and lets look at them togther.

Certainly the data from them will show what you claim?.....

Manufacturers links directly to it would be fine.

Skater doesnt know how to build a boat... Schiada....







UD
Dude I love Skaters and respect those people! do not go there ,the D-100 Is your Balsa Wood While
the A-600 is Corecell Oop's Now What happened??? See my point!

And Uncle I have been building VERY light boats for a long time Dannys 33' National Champion boat ,that staggered hull and deck weighed 1800 Pounds in 1992 it lives on as a pleasure boat in the NE somewhere today.

Uncle what is the lightest boat you ever built??

Last edited by Steve 1; 01-15-2010 at 12:07 AM.
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:27 AM
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Dude I love Skaters and respect those people! do not go there ,the D-100 Is your Balsa Wood While
the A-600 is Corecell Oop's Now What happened??? See my point!

And Uncle I have been building VERY light boats for a long time Dannys 33' National Champion boat ,that staggered hull and deck weighed 1800 Pounds in 1992 it lives on as a pleasure boat in the NE somewhere today.

Uncle what is the lightest boat you ever built??

Skater (along with a LOT of successful companies) use balsa on the running bottoms which you say you would only plant flowers in. Who is going there?


Im open to your data! but you dont send it.

you link us to a VHS videotape that just has #'s I cant find the manufacturers data for D100. You say its balsa but it doesn't look like any balsa Ive seen. Ive been around balsa 20 years, maybe not as long as you, but a loong time

( did you make that tape, or did a third party make it?)

Just link us to the makers of D100 and the aircell you use- so we can see it side by side.

Are you a manufacturer?
Sounds like you are trying to "Sell" us.

I am not a manufacturer but my pet manufacturer offered me a choice of core material and layups, as well as an explanation of the plusses and minuses of each.



UD
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Uncle Dave View Post
Skater (along with a LOT of successful companies) use balsa on the running bottoms which you say you would only plant flowers in. Who is going there?

Im open to your data! but you dont send it.

you link us to a VHS videotape that just has #'s I cant find the manufacturers data for D100. You say its balsa but it doesn't look like any balsa Ive seen. Ive been around balsa 20 years, maybe not as long as you, but a loong time

( did you make that tape, or did a third party make it?)

Just link us to the makers of D100 and the aircell you use- so we can see it side by side.

Are you a manufacturer?
Sounds like you are trying to "Sell" us.

I am not a manufacturer but my pet manufacturer offered me a choice of core material and layups, as well as an explanation of the plusses and minuses of each.



UD
That Video was done by a Laboratory so forget the Cheap shot on that !!your wood broke and the plastic did NOT Deal with it, those product numbers correspond with the manufacturers

Dude Skater does a Dam good job with it is why.

No I build custom One Off Plastic Cored boats I am not trying to sell core! You have the Baltic link for The D-100

Corecell is on line I had the link on my site but Gurit is their site name since they merged with SP systems a while back then explain why the wood broke and the plastic did not! Remember Some static numbers are completely worthless in a dynamic world.

Last edited by Steve 1; 01-15-2010 at 12:56 AM.
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