Its over..... "The common man"
02-25-2012 | 06:35 AM
#103
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Posts: 5,825
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From: Clarkston, Michigan
Donzi is not "gone"! In bankruptcy, yes, but don't call them gone. The Classics may me done though, which goes right back to the point of this thread about entry level performance boats.
02-25-2012 | 07:50 AM
#105
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 150
Likes: 25
Agree on the Engine Prices!!
Running along the lines of CrownHawg's post I keep seeing lots of new Ferrari type boats, the entry level manufacturers listed seem like the Camry and Taurus end of the fleet. While they may be fine family cars, they're not very exciting. What we really need is a some new Corvettes and Mustangs. They're not the fastest or fanciest things out there but have attitude and performance to avoid being to satisfy most people. Not necessarily cheap, but with financing, within reach of most people with salary under 100K.
Engine costs blow me away. When you cam buy an entire car for the cost of 1 outboard motor, or a house for the cost of some of the sterndrive engines, it's insane. I have good knowledge of what goes into an engine and makes it tick. I just can't imagine why a basic 525 engine should cost 30K for maybe 6K in parts. I know companies must make a profit to operate, but what's the difference between making a living and a killing?
I guess that's why I collect other peoples junk and rebuild it myself into something I want. I'll never turn a profit on my labor but at least I get to enjoy something I could not otherwise afford.
Engine costs blow me away. When you cam buy an entire car for the cost of 1 outboard motor, or a house for the cost of some of the sterndrive engines, it's insane. I have good knowledge of what goes into an engine and makes it tick. I just can't imagine why a basic 525 engine should cost 30K for maybe 6K in parts. I know companies must make a profit to operate, but what's the difference between making a living and a killing?
I guess that's why I collect other peoples junk and rebuild it myself into something I want. I'll never turn a profit on my labor but at least I get to enjoy something I could not otherwise afford.
I understand these marine engines are not sold in great volume but come on there is a limit on the amount of profit you can make on any product. Their pricing will only affect their sales.
Its just plain RIDICULOUS!
02-25-2012 | 07:51 AM
#106
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 3,066
Likes: 8
From: Ocala, Fl
My take on all of this is that there appears to be a healthy market for good used, clean, turn-key performance boats in the under $25K price range.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
02-25-2012 | 08:04 AM
#107
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,309
Likes: 1,815
From: Merritt Island, FL
My take on all of this is that there appears to be a healthy market for good used, clean, turn-key performance boats in the under $25K price range.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
02-25-2012 | 08:06 AM
#108
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
From: Cinnaminson, NJ
My take on all of this is that there appears to be a healthy market for good used, clean, turn-key performance boats in the under $25K price range.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
Examples would be early '80's to mid '90's Formulas, Welcrafts, Chris Crafts, Bajas, Sonics, etc that were popular 25~30 years ago. The boat would need to be turn-key because most guys will never get spousal approval to buy something for the family that "only needs....".
In most parts of the country this action would be seasonal due to the affliction of winter. In areas of the south and west like Central and South Florida, Southern California and Arizona the business would be less seasonal because of boating being available year round.
If the boats for sale have simple systems like Mercruiser small and big block Chevy power and predominately Alpha drive systems that parts are plentiful and inexpensive...they would sell. Load them up with amenities like great sound systems and re-furbed seating and upholstery ( women won't tolerate old worn out $hit) with a reliable trailer and you have the magic boat that is affordable. So I find a 23' '85 Chris Craft Scorpion with a single 260 Merc that is on a decent trailer but needs a re-power. I buy it for $4500 or less, put a re-built long block in it, upgrade the cockpit interior, put a decent middle of the road sound system in it and hang a $11,995 For Sale sign on it and let them beat me down to $10,500. I have $7500 in it and clear $3K.
The target demographic is the 35~45 year old married couple with 2: teens or pre teens and a annual household income of $75k~$100K living in Indianapolis,St. Louis, Atlanta, Baltimore or Phoenix. They probably have $15K~$20K in savings and would strongly consider parting with a big chunk of that to buy recreation that the whole family can enjoy for 4~5 years before the kids move out.
I think this is doable. The risk is whether or not my demographic is confident enough in the economy and the stability of their employment to spend the money.
I'm sure I'm not the only one that has considered this idea or something similar.
02-25-2012 | 08:11 AM
#109
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,008
Likes: 752
From: Traverse City, Michigan
I was looking at the Miami OSO party and poker run pictures and noticed something that sorta fits into this discussion. This isn't a young group, there are many grey and balding heads in those pictures which represent some long time hard working people that have worked their way up the scale in the business world.
Some of these guys probably were "common men" and had a 23' run about but they succeeded and are in a place where they can now spend.
I'm sure a number of current "common men" will move up, turn grey haired or bald and eventually own a mega-bling boat.
ed
Some of these guys probably were "common men" and had a 23' run about but they succeeded and are in a place where they can now spend.
I'm sure a number of current "common men" will move up, turn grey haired or bald and eventually own a mega-bling boat.
ed
02-25-2012 | 08:19 AM
#110
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 6,212
Likes: 376
From: Plainville/Old Lyme, CT Boca Raton, FL
You just nailed it right there. With the current status of our economy the younger people will never be able to move up and afford these high end boats. So, the people that can afford them are just getting older which is why you see the change over to all of these center consoles. I'm 26 and I am very fortunate to be able to afford what I have, and do the stuff I do but most people my age that I know are crying about spending $100 at the bar. So, I don't see many young people getting into the sport....
