wyane why do you have to bash the superboat?
everyone can see by your post that you are loyal to the progerssion product and that great

there's one thing thing that you might not know for the last 2 years f1-68 superboat usa has spanked team progression on the sbi/opa circut over and over again
just my $.02

OK, I don't want to add fuel to the fire here so I won't.
Let me just say that a LOT depends on the DRIVER and leave it at that. :cool: :cool:

BTW, GRH are you going to make it to Lake George on Sunday? I really was hoping for a look at that transom. :D :D :D

I wouldn't mind running with in my Activator with you guys in the ocean.

JIM H
I don't believe that Progression(f1-54) has raced an APBA race in the last 2 years. This would make it impossible for Eddie(f1-68) to have put a spanken on (f1-54) time and time again! The only race they might have been to in the last two years was the first day of Key West last year. I can't remember for sure.

BJM,

The F1 Progression has run a couple times here in Jersey with OPA/SBI against Eddie..

just an FYI....

carry-on gentlemen...;)

Has anyone been to all of these factories?
I've been to Superboat about 5 years ago, and it was very unimpressive. I'm not sure if they have moved...
And a freind of mine had a 1981 w/ 225, it was one helluva performing boat, but very light.
I live on Long Island, and the only factory that slightly resembles the plants in FL is Hustler.
Most of the top glass guys in the industry are down in the south.
And lastly, which hull is a copy of which?:confused:

I have only been to the Progression factory and agree that it is not very impressive. The product they put out, however, is what impressed me. As for who copied whom, I couldn't say but the Progression is an original design - they have the original plugs to prove it.

I don't usually chime in on these pissing contest but, we already have a Long Island Manufacturers Race in the works in Freeport, Grand Bahama Island this coming October 19th.
Where is Progression and Superboat? Hmmm?
Oh Yeah, it's an ocean race.:p

Trip and fall , barking up the wrong tree ?? who are you sir , mr offshore ? You know so much about pricing , tell us what the real prices are if i am wrong . Next time you see a superboat put a straight edge on the bottom and see how straight it is .I didnt want this to turn ugly but you superboat fans want it that way . If you notice all the guys that like pantera dont knock any of the other 2 boats . I was not knocking the superboat just telling the truth . And if you dont think the progression hull is made at least 2 times better and stronger than the 24 superboat im sorry for you , because you dont know squat !!

Wow, what a difference a day makes. What dose this have to do
with comparing a 24' Superboat to a Pantera. The 2 are copies from an old P&D at least that’s as far as I was able to trace back several years ago. This is the most copied design in
history of boats with names like, SUPERBOAT, PANTERA, JAWS, PYTHON, VECTOR, CORSA, ACTIVATOR, and guys like John Coen could give you a lot more, these boats were copied because the worked and still do.

As far as the whole Superboat/Progression thing goes, its true, every time I've tested in the South Bay and waved at a progression owner they never wave back, At the New York
race this year some one wrote ASS HOLE on the back of my Explorer (w/SUPERBOAT taggs) and signed it PROGRESSION OWNER, what the F..., maybe if they new me I would understand. I have never sat here and bashed Progression Boats, or stated that worst handling boat that I've ridden in is a 27 Progression or that you pay all that money and the boat has no liner
and that If Jim Arvis ( Probably the best Vbottom driver along with BJ) couldn't make his progression handle then no one could. So why do you guys have to get in here and start a
bunch of s...

As far as the original question BJ has owned a 24 and a 28 Pantera he may be able to give
some insight on the 24, and Jo is a great guy to talk to should you have any question as far
a the construction of his boats, call John should you have any questions about Superboat 631-226-1761 he is short on words but is honest and a fair and what he tells you is what you'll get.
I would say the 2 boat will handle the same and priced the same, check out the interiors and see what suits your taste.

Eddie Simmons
Superboatusa.com

I think Pantera has made the 24 since the mid 70s, '75 '76? I think the only one to have a chance a preceding it is the P & D? Maybe? i thought they were all based from the 24 cig or magnum?. I really don't know but sharing my thought process.

Fast eddy your a heck of a racer! :)

Eddy,

I find your comments most interesting..

You say you , "never sat here and bashed Progressions" and then that's what you go and do ! Come on !

The worst handling boats ? - I don't think so - Does having or not having a liner make a boat better ? - I think that's all subjective..as far as defacing your truck - a##holes plain and simple..whoever they were .

There's a whole lot more and another side to the Jim Arvis story..lets leave it at that .

I own a Progression and I'm happy with my choice . I also like Superboats and have said so many times on this board . Hey - I almost bought one . In fact I met you when John was showing me the factory and you were finishing up the race boat !
It was and still is awesome .

In terms of racing , neither of these two manufacturers are exactly tearing up the field . The fact of the matter is that Kryptonite and Activator have dominated the F-1 class for the last two years as far as I can recall . Somehow , we forget that there are another two high quality boats being manufactured here on the island !

My point is that BOTH Progression AND Superboat owners are proud of their boats and have a right to be but neither of them are necessarily the fastest..the quickest boats (comparable size) I saw all Summer were a white Activator in the rough stuff and a yellow Kryptonite that allegedly does close to 100 !

Run your boat out in Hampton Bays and I promise to wave at you and buy you a drink at Oakland's by the inlet.

Take 'er easy !

- - Wes

WAYNE - When you type in caps its yelling.... I think its safe to say you & I will never agree.... So I'll leave this by saying... Who invited Progression into a thread titled Pantera 24 vs Superboat 24?

LASTER - I have a 4 O'Clock wedding Sat & 2 Soccer games sunday so I'm out for this weekend.... From what SHANE tells me... and he has been in my boat.... You run early 90's... I run early 80's.... I concede.... my boat has a naturally aspirated 454... SHANE said you run a 502 blower motor? Have a great day on Lake George.... I hope you get perfect weather.... I'm outta HERE.... but not before saying

SUPERBOAT OR NO BOAT;)

SUPERBOAT won the Manufacturers cup two years ago....

GRH, sorry you won't be able to make it this weekend. I hope we will be able to hook up next season as I really do want to see your boat. You see, I have never ridden in a 24 Superboat (had a short ride in a 21 once) and would love to see first hand how it compares. I am not really a gung ho racer, I was just kidding around. Shane is right but he shouldn't be passing out that kind of info, kinda spoils the surprise.:D I have a lot of respect for all of the boats being discussed and don't want to contribute to the general pissing contest that this has become. If anyone has questions about the Progression 24 I would be happy to answer in a PM.

LASTER - You sound like someone I could spend the day BS'in about boats with.... Are you a regular on Lake George? I'm on Sacandaga.... half hour ride from LG Village... great lake ... no speed limits(yet) .... If you are a regular on LG I'd be happy to show you around Sacandaga... you'd like it... not as wide as LG & not nearly as many boats on the weekend.... makes for more opportunity to run 60-70 for a few miles at a time.... anyway I'm real disappointed I can't make this weekend.... and I'd like very much to see your boat... from what SHANE has told me its beautiful.... the only progression I ever rode/drove in was a 237 with 2.5 EFI.... 95..96?.... I was impressed with the boat... I believe it ran 70ish with 2 people & a ton of fuel & beer;) .... handled like it was on a railroad track.... thats my only expirience so I have no axe to grind!.... Keep in touch .....

we can all get along .

Wayne,

Accuse the right people. I have not once bashed Progression, Superboat or Pantera. On the contrary I said that when I choose my next bost I will have a tough time. I did, however, point out what I thought were each boat's strengths. As far as pricing is concerned I don't want to give away any trade information that is not appropriate, but suffice it to say that Superboats are much less expensive than Progressions, and for obvious reasons. So again, if you;re looking for a fight you are barking up the wrong tree and no I'm not Mr Offshore and I don't need to be either.

Fair enough. let's get along.

At the New York QUOTE]Originally posted by fastedy
[B], At the New York
race this year some one wrote ASS HOLE on the back of my Explorer (w/SUPERBOAT taggs) and signed it PROGRESSION OWNER, what the F..., maybe if they new me I would understand. Maybe because you parked in front of the truck and boat that was marked off with orange cones. And two other vehicles had to move to get the rig out .And it was signed Walter I believe. Remember flat palm up means hello

For what it's worth, I went a whole year without a boat as I was searching for my next. Every boat mentioned in this thread was a consideration (except for the Bayliners and Bajas:eek: )
If it was a good deal, I would have purchased any of them.

24' Debate
 

In the debate of competent 24' ers, where does the 24' Condor (from Hialeah Gardens..orig.) fit into the foray? I owned a 1990 with over 1000 hours on the hull. It ran like a mother, and had only 2 small spidercracks on the whole rig after a decade or service in both Southern Atlantic and Northern Atlantic waters.

Wayne "2 times better"-just wondering how you come up with that formula-scientific study?

I'm new here, but... THE FACTS
 

Here are the facts:

Superboat vs. Progession:

Fully balsa cored? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes

Blueprinted bottom out of the factory? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes

All composite construction? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes (Superboat uses plywood for stringers and bulkheads).

Thru-bolted rubrail? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes

AME 4000 resin in construction? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes

100% Vacuum bagged? Superboat: No -----------Progression: Yes

Any Progression of the same size with the same power is faster than a Superboat. Any Progression of the same size is lighter than a Superboat. Any Progression of ANY size is stronger than a Superboat. Superboat's warrantee is half that of Progression. You're comparing a Lexus to a Chevy here.

Fastedy, your boat is very nice, and you run it well. Progression does not use hull liners because the hull is tabbed, glassed, and thru-bolted together. That cannot be done on a boat with a liner. If you look inside a Progression, you'll see the composite bulkheads everywhere. A liner will conceal damage from the inside.

You are all smart (I hope) and this information is a phone call away. Call up Baltek and ask them about Progression - they supply the composite panels that they use. For information on Superboat's materials, call Home Depot.

You can laugh, but these are the facts. They are both nice boats, but just not in the same league. Anyone that know anything about these boats will agree to this. Yeah, I'm waiting for you all to bash me because I'm new here.

Yes, I am a Progression owner, and I researched this information. If I wanted a Bayliner, I would have bought one.

Misty

WOW another first time poster.

I really don't care what you drive as long as you show me a picture.:)

Brian

thank god we have a expert on the board now!!!!

misty you are new and maybe you should mind you own business
this started as a pantera/superboat thing

now go out in the great south bay and play nice with your progression

jh

Jim H,

I'm sorry, but you seem a little offended. I was not trying to talk smack here - what I said is the facts. Like I said, I made the calls and did my research. It is what it is. If I am wrong, I would like someone to correct me. Please do.

By the way, I don't live on the bay where the boats are made. I don't even live in New York.




Misty

Misty,

Good information. The differences you mentioned all sum up to why Progression costs more than a Superboat. I think we are saying the same thing, which is that Progression is built differently and that is reflected in the price. I think that a lot of the Superboat guys would suggest that the differences do not sum up to a boat which is twice as good. Superboats rarely, if ever, break. John has been know to fix virtually anything that goes wrong. Also, translate all of the differences into overall performance and you get 3-4 mph. Now add rough water and the equation changes because the winner of the race must be a good driver and have a reliable engine. It's kind of like this: if you take a good old boy with a Camaro and put him up against a guy driving a foreign sports car with all the latest technology, you can see how the good old boy may just fare better than the Euro-guy. I'm not knocking anybody here, by the way. The point is, if you choose to spend money on the finer details then so be it. But ultimately, if we are talking performance on the water, what counts is who finishes first. Nobody can deny that both Superboat and Progression have had their good days and bad. But I would suggest that the guys who start knocking on one boat or the other go out and meet on the water and report the results. One day when I can afford the finer touches of higher grade materials I just might buy them. On the other hand, I might also realize that for me they aren't worth it. Bottom line, there is always a better, faster, more expensive boat out there. So just when one guy claims he has a better boat, look out because behind him will be his successor. I think we should group together as lovers of Northeast built boats and create a rivalry against Florida built boats. Just for the fun of it. Here's a brief breakdown:
North:
Activator
Kryptonite
Superboat
Hustler
Outerlimits
Progression

Florida:
Pantera
Powerplay
Cigarette
Apache
Sutphen
Phantom

Rtaylor,
I think your only problem with that will be the fact that you will be way out numbered.:) There are a bunch more boat builders in Florida than you named. I think if you add up the number built in the North and the number built in the South there are a ton more built down South. :D :D Maybe it shoud be a rivalry of East versus West...oh wait there already is one. Great boat are built everywhere. How about we all stick together and have a rivalry again PWC riders and tree huggers.:D :D :D :D :D

MISTY - My 96 SUPERBOAT 24 definitely has a through bolted rub rail..... as far as the rest of the BS you spewed....I leave it at that.... like Jim H said.... go enjoy your boat for what it is.... bad mouthing other boats doesn't make yours better... certainly not faster!

Caincando,

I think you're right. My list is incomplete for the Northeast as well as Florida. What we should do is start a rivalry against PWC's and sailors!

Re: I'm new here, but... THE FACTS
 

Misty [/B][/QUOTE]
You're comparing a Lexus to a Chevy here


Anytime you want to race my Z06 with your Lexus just let me know...

What's a Z06?

And all this started from two Cuban guys named

Padro and Dominguez

Must have been some really good stuff back then.


:cool:

I almost forgot all about those blow boats. good call:D :D

Rtaylor,
I couldn’t agree more with your post a couple back that begins with”Good information”.

A Z06 is the 400+ horsepower Corvette. I don’t even own one but I couldn’t help not commenting on the irony of Misty’s statement comparing Lexus to Chevy… build schedule/price=faster, not always.

DLG,

Gee, thanks. It's not all that common around here to get some agreement.

It dose'nt matter the Pantera will kick all ass and make you all look like the fools you are HA!

Don99,

You know what? You're right.

keep dreaming !!! bring one of those thing up to newyork and we will see !!!