Roller lifters input
 

Im looking for some iput on what is the best roller lifters out there right now?Most likely it will be a solid roller cam with Jesel shaft rockers and such but not sure on what roller lifters yet.Every company has good and bad batches it seems but does anybody have any ides or input on what they have had good luck with.Im wanting to build a strong and reliable valveterain.BBC,Dart block and heads.

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Crower 66291 with pin oiling option,

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I am with GPM.

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Alot of people are saying Crower as well.Anybody have any experience with Jesel's lifters?

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Any advantage to the .937's over the .903's?or can they even be used?

Im going to check into getting the Jesels first but the Crowers seem to be what most people are liking.

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I have had good luck with the Crowers and Reed and Dave have stood behind them also.

Why are ya going solid roller??

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johnydcb
the best lifter as mentioned is jesel and yes they are pricey but you get what you pay for here are some pics of the .903 lifters installed in a block with a symmetrical port pro stock head and you can get them with and without offset both Comp and Crower will work but if you can afford the Jesels get them you will not regret it.

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I am going to try the Schubeck Roller X's and see what happens. Here is another lifter available. They created these after using the Jessels for years. Not sure how well they work. And they too are very proud of them..

http://www.lsmeng.com/Lifters.html

I had them put bushing in my block back in 99 and was real happy with there quality of work. The owner's son is somewhat opinionated, but they do a nice job.

Dick

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Dick: Thanks for trying the Schubecks, I think they are a good idea. Good luck with the experiment.

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I hope it goes well myself. I had the flat tappet lifters from Joe and I couldnt keep a cam under it.. The Ultradyne lasted 90 hrs and the new Lunati cam lasted about 5hrs.. Of course Lunati said that is was the lifters not the bubbles they cast into the cam lobes for free that caused the failure. And of course Jay never did give me the discount he promised in the beginning for being a business.. but we move on. Oh yeah.. no more LUNATI for this boater!!
Here are some pics of my progress. Not sure how they will look.
The slot process is going slow. The material used for the lifter bore bushings is very hard to drill.. About an hour a hole so far. And these are a .903 lifter.

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Dick,
As you said the other night on the phone, those holes you drilled look real close to the outer edge of the bushing. I can see from the picture that the groove doesn't go all the way down the bushing. I just hope there is enough material left to keep everything happy and in place.

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There is more material left at the bottom of the bore than this pic shows. I dont think that will be an issue. I did figure out why some lifters were not fitting in some of the holes. The pin has sides to it and the slot needs to be the proper depth. After getting the slot lenght, I ran the bit up and down quickly and it seemed to open it up a bit and the lifter falls right into place without binding now.. All in how you drill the hole, as they say?? So far I am very happy with my progess. We'll see how they hold up. Going to run the H out of it this summer to test my drive. Besides, gas the following summer wont be any cheaper..

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Dick: How long is the slot? If you were starting from scratch without bushings do you think it would be feasible for a good shop to install bushings that were already slotted? Which approach is more likely to put the slot in exactly the right place?

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I know LSM did that very thing back when I had them bush my block in 99. The bushings for the Jessels that they used at that time were slotted and installed in the block. Not sure how they indexed them, but probably on one of their CNC machines.
The slots I am cutting are about 7/8" - 1" long. It would be much easier to push in slotted bushing, but I figured the drilling wouldnt be so difficult. I think the material the bushings are made of is why I am having so much difficulty. I have managed to get the time down to about 30 or 40 mins. per hole. The drill I am using is turning about 100rpm. very slow! The bit will bind up and then I use a diamond bit in a dremel tool to open it up. So far so good. The tool Joe made for this is a hardened plug with the slot and a bar that goes to another plug in the lifer bore next to it on the same plane ( exhaust/exhaust or intake/intake).
I am happy with how things are working out.. just slow progess..

Dick

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Dick,

I am curious... Could you post a picture of the jig that Joe makes for the drilling?

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Sure Vinny... here you go!

I keep tryin to attach em.. not much luck.. hmmm
I will start all over again...

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One more time..

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I like it, simple and functional.

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Yeah.. Simple and functional.. 8 done, 8 more to go.. whew.

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I have run Comp, Crane and now Isky solid rollers. I have only had one go bad and that was the Comp, which I caught before it came apart. The key is routine valve lash checks. I use Eickert 2 pc valve covers and can have the lash checked in about 10 minutes, which is no big deal. I also run Jesel shaft rockers, which rarely ever move more than .001" between lash settings. If all of a sudden one is .005" - .010" more lash than original setting there is probably something going on. If you keep the net lift at .680 - .700 and use a cam with gentle ramps it is a plus. Also don't go crazy with spring selection. Many drag race guys are using 300+ seat pressure springs, which will not live in a marine engine very long. I like the broad power band and increased RPM potential of solids, but regular checks and maintenance is required!! Good luck!

Mr. Gadgets,
Keep us posted on the new stuff you are trying!! It looks cool!

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I was running the Isky's with 260# on the seat, .685" Lift. I was watching the lash, maybe not as often as I should, but a wheel broke at 40 hrs. Kinda discouraged me to the rollers. So I tried the Flat tappet route and didnt find a cam that would hold up to the Schubeck Flat tappets. They looked great, but the cam noses would get pits in them. Spalling I believe on OSO'er said. LSM told me they could build a cam that would work, but that was after I got the Roller X's. I am hoping for the best.. we'll see and let you know, believe me.
PS... I won't purchase any thing from Lunati cams in the future..

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Mr.G, Crower used to sell a groove lock lifter that looked just like the ones you are going to use. The only problem with them , the little bb would wear off.

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Now you're trying to scare me.. I am hoping the bb wont wear off. The first design had flat spots on them and a bracket that was bolted to the block to keep them from rotating. I think Chevy is using that system in their motors.
Not sure how much time people have on these, but I have only heard one person speak negatively.. and he wanted to sell me a set of his for $1850 plus the machine work and new bushings.. We'll see. I know there wont be any trouble with axles, but after that, it's all new. Joe says they have been out for about a year. I am keeping my fingers crossed that this an answer to it..

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I'm not trying to scare anyone, I tried the Crower version they were shot after one season. I don't think they sell them any more for the BBC application. I've been running the 66291 hippo for the last 3 seasons, I've run them up at 7500 rpms many times, and knock on wood they haven't let me down. I run over .750 lift and well over 700 lb open pressure. Sounds like you have had some bad luck and I hope this works for you.

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I must have missed something,I thought the 66291 were Crowers?You had good luck with them though right?

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At first we wanted to go with a Hyd roller but now the guy that is building the motor wants to go Solid roller,more rpm and maybe more power is what im thinking.Only going to spin the motor 6500 or so,not over that though.

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Looks like its time to start shopping for a good deal on either Jesels or Crowers.Feel free to pm me with any ideas of where to shop for them.

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GPM... not pointing fingers.. I hope it works too. And yes, the rollers and I have a history.. kinda ugly matter of fact. :( :(
But i hope to win this war before I meet my maker. :drink:

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Morel has limited travel hyd. Set up is like a solid lifter and they will go 8K.

Chris

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Chris,
Can .700 - .720 lift be achieved with those lifters and can they be run 6500 RPM safely at those lifts for sustained periods?

Thanks,

Craig

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So far so good on a twin pro charged engine with 100hrs on them.

Chris

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That is good to hear! Sounds like hydraulic roller technology is progressing nicely!

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3rd generation will be out late this fall.

Chris

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I didn't have good luck with the Crower Groove Lock solid lifters, I haven't had had any problems with the Crower Severe Duty 66291 w/ hppo option, again solid roller. Sorry for the confusion.
What model DCB do you have?

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Chris
Just to clarify are you talking about the morel lifters??? Lifters and p/rods are the last thing I need to pick up to finish my 502 project and I'm leaning toward morels if I can find them at a decent price. (hyd-rollers) Lift is high 5,s with a pro charger...... Also Scott,(cfm) suggested I ask you for a good machine shop in so. calif ?? Thankyou
Jere

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Thanks for clearing that up.Looks like I'm gonna go with a .903 lifter from Jesel or Crower Severe Duty's.

It's a Mach26.

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jere,
You can call me or e-mail me and I will give you some suggestions.
423 854 0007 Office
[email protected]

Chris

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The Mach 26 is a very nice boat, they can handle the speed.

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I have no worries about the boat,its me that hasnt been that fast behind the wheel before. LOL Im excited to see how this thing will excellerate thats for sure.

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Just a thought here.. the solid rollers.. it was mentioned they can handle 6-8k rpm.. but how do they handle 600 rpm for all the no wake zones? I think that is where my problem exsists.. low rpm, at least that is what I have been told.. :eek: :eek: