44MTI

I as well as other took the tone to be very negative, mostly with the unfair comparisons and statements like"If you like driving as fast as possibe, side-by-side then please take the Race to on of the offshore racing Organization. But please leave the poker runs to the those boaters who are there to have a good time on the water." I see that as condensending and arrogant". I like to do both and do on most runs. Since you haven't attended the runs then you may not understand it or take it as personal as we do.
I'm glad your thinking about doing some runs, Your right, we are having alot of fun, but with articles like this they won't be around for long.

388Hustler

I'm still trying to figure out why we are being lectured by people that don't even run in poker runs... Do you guys have any frigging clue how many boats run in poker runs/fun runs year around? Compare that number to number of boats at your "professional races" and then compare the number of accidents. It should become very clear to you. If you still can't do the math, let me know and I will do it for you.

I don't owe anyone an apology or anything else for that matter.

Dean

44MTI

The one major incident that eveyone keeps going to, Unfortunately, was not caused because of speed as many want to think. It may have been a contributing factor, but a basic human error caused it. I have been been thrown out of a top gun going half their speed because of the same mistake. There are always going to be incidents, you must accept that. If not your only fooling yourself, if that is the case you should stop driving any boats, cars, flying in planes or anything else. We have to make this as safe as possible keep the accident rate as low as possible. Which I think we are doing a pretty good job of, but there is always room for improvement.

What many of us don't care for are writers and racers,many of whom have never been on a run, telling us how unsafe and irresponsilble we are when are accident to participation rate is much better.

388Hustler

Where did I say any death was acceptable?
Please don't try to take my post out of context.
How many deaths have there been racing?
I merely stated a few facts that you won't acknowledge

Safety should be addressed but not the way it was published in EBM.

There are thousands more boats that run poker/fun runs compared to racing. Would you like to compare the accident to boat ratio?

A poker run is not a race.

I have personally run in a lot of poker runs over the years with probably more than 2,000 boats. I can't recall anyone ever being injured or killed.

People that don't run in the poker/fun runs should stay out of this.

Dean

388Hustler

Mark,
I will agree with you on the safety equipment. Don't you think that could be addressed without a bs story in EBM?
Dean

388Hustler

Sorry, I guess I should have broken it down a little further for you.
People that don't have first hand knowledge and try to act as though they do should stay out of this.
Is that better?

44MTI

I wish if you had something positive or constructive to say you would do so instead of this BS. I am sorry but that is the way I feel. I don't mind having a meaningful debate with someone, not an argument. But I see no comparison between the shuttle and this accident. This accident was caused be a human mistake, plain and simple. The shuttle accident was caused by a mechanical failure.

.

44MTI

I have NEVER said we are "good enough", In fact if you look at my post I think I have made a point to always say there is room for improvement.I may be a little to close to the flame on this one but I still believe the record will back me, that given the number of boats and events each yr, verses the accidents we are doing pretty good, with room for improvement, much better than the racers and much better than Ron portrayed us as. And that is my basis for complaint against him. If you can show me where the percentage of accident verses attendance is greater for poker runs than races I will gladly apologize. Until then, I think he owes us an topology.
PS. I do appreciate your fairness and common sense in this debate. Now if you want to have some fun come run with us before they are gone.

louietherigger

I race and poker run, fact is no one should get hurt or killed in either, but its a high speed event (both race and fun runs). Safety should be # 1, sometimes people can be hazardous in both venues , so before we lose all our freedoms we should police our own events and eliminate the a-holes who put us all at risk, like a 150 mph cat loaded with novices passing a 50 mph vee-hull within 30' and i could go on. Just because some one brings up a negative about poker runs or racing, doesn't mean there wishing for them to end. Maybe its just a wake up call.

Have fun and be safe,
Louietherigger

nolimits

Fact is, Poker runs are set up and monitored differently all over the country. People who claim they never have problems with boater's racing or booze and all wear the correct gear and everyone behaves so they are offended are part of the problem. We get out of hand, and we do it often. There is a large enough part of the boaters who are racing. We should police, and do it aggresively. But we will argue and get insulted and ignore the truth. So in the end, on Long Island or in Miami or on Lake Tahoe someone is going to kill or get killed and the media will push the issue forward for us. We will loose control and laws will be made. So while we piss at Ron, and get annoyed that his view does not represent our view in our corner of the globe we miss the boat..... It will play out and we will loose this battle.