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Old 12-22-2003, 10:40 PM
  #21
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Well here is my .02 whether or not that it's worth much. First off the magic wave crusher weight number seems to be 10,000+ Lbs anything under that seems to jump around not saying that it takes away from the ride but definitely gets a little more flighty.

Second the most important thing is the CG of the boat if it doesn't fly right then you might as well give it up whether it be nose heavy or ass heavy in the rough you can't stay on the gas or you gonna get wet, go swimming, or get hurt.

Third is the speed I agree with Too Old as how often are you going to be running over 100. Lets face it at 100 there's a whole lot of things going on at once. I always describe it like driving in a constant earthquake and not a small temblor I am talking 5.0+ on the Richter scale which is a pretty good shake. And alot of people that say they have been over 100 or close to a 100 when they get in a boat that actually does it usually have to do a laundry check at the dock when they get back or find a garbage can to huck in.

Steps well that subject is wide open personally I am not a big fan but you have to have them to keep up with the Jones. To step or not to step that is the question? But with steps usually comes more flat surface on the bottom of the boat which takes away from ride but does give you speed.

Now the next question and this is not my area of expertise but I have been in enough to know is do you aerate or ventilate the bottom or both.

With all that being said I still believe if you set it up and balance it correctly you can still achieve both with out making a lot of sacrifices.

Also there's no replacement for displacement. But for all the displacement you take away you should replace it with length so it then becomes a spanning tool instead of a crushing tool. I truly believe though that if a 41'-43' Apache - Cig style boat is set up properly with the same hp as for instance a 42' OL or 43' NorTech out in 4'-6' seas the Apache - Cig boat will give it one hell of a run for its money if not edge it out. No disrespect to either boats as they are fabulous pieces and I have run both many times. I just think the narrow beam boat is the way to go.

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Last edited by sean stinson; 12-22-2003 at 10:42 PM.
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Old 12-22-2003, 10:46 PM
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I would think that current owners of step bottom Cigarettes could shed some light as to whether their boats ride as well as the old non-step hulls which are also heavier than the current Cigs. That should say something about whether technology can overcome the need for a heavy boat in order to get a wave crushing ride. I for one would rather be riding on top of the waves as opposed to going through them.
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Old 12-22-2003, 10:54 PM
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I agree , one can not always run over 100mph. But a boat that will run over 100 does have an 85mph cruise speed. I don't get bored running 85mph all day.
Vs or cat it's all good and there is room for everybody.

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Old 12-22-2003, 10:59 PM
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I have run the stepped Cigs and yes it still has the ride but as I said it was definitely alot more flighty but it weighed 8600 Lbs with fuel in it and ran 91 on its best day in race trim. But I spent alot of time balancing it also you just had to watch it in the turns but that doesn't pertain here because this is more about pleasure boating and not racing.

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Old 12-22-2003, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by mmwalters
Why have a v bottom?
My best friend owns a cat and we run together a lot. I think my V rides better, Its easier to rack, a LOT easier to trailer. and easier to get into a dock. Not to mention I have a great cabin. If all you want is a poker run rocket ship than a cat is probably the way to go, but I use mine as a bop around party boat, and I can't imagine a better boat for me.
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Old 12-22-2003, 11:11 PM
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I would rather have a boat that runs 75-80 in comfort. To me a 35cafe or 38 top gun would be the perfect boat. You can run 75-80 and sleep at any port in style. 35 sonic also gives you this option. Trust me, I would love to run over a 100, I just don't think I could afford the repair bills!!!! Just my .02
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Old 12-23-2003, 07:29 AM
  #27
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My experiences would also reflect what sean has pointed out, even slight increases in beam do dramatically affect the ride in the rough, long and lean vs. short and fat wins everytime. The 41-43 ft. length continues to have a little magic when it comes to the spanning waves / Hp to push it ratio. I've had both and the difference between a REAL 38 and a REAL 41 is surprising when the waves exceed a REAL 4 ft.
And finally, whenever we run against the new faster bottom designs in the rough and all the boats are paying their dues, we do seem to be able to more than just hold our own with a better than average score in the SPEED x BEATING x PUCKER FACTOR equation
 
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Old 12-23-2003, 08:38 AM
  #28
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Morning everone, the only pain I have today is the wallet pain I will be feeling when I purchase a 41 this spring. Thanks Parn, I was extremly impressed yesterday. I have heard for years that the 41 foot range is a perfect combo for ruff water and I finally got to find that out yesterday first hand. It's often ruff on Lake Michigan so long and heavy is all good around here.
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Old 12-23-2003, 08:39 AM
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Wicked i am with you on that one my friend. Kick it up to 4-6 foot seas and I will take the 10,000 - 13,000 lb wave crusher and spanning narrow boat everytime. And balance it so it will fly and the equation is near complete. Add power and you have an awesome piece. I will put that 100 - 110 mph boat up against pretty much anything in its class anytime.

PS I tried to find you in KW but just kept crossing paths with you at different times.

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Old 12-23-2003, 08:58 AM
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I know of 2 boats brands that can run 100 mph plus with small power. I know they can both run in seas or calm conditions. cb
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