Re: Marine Lubrication
 

RH at 12 hours I would change to a synthetic, after all Corvette, Viper, Porsche come with synthetic right from the factory.I would change the oil now with whatever oil I want to use. There is no reason to change in the spring. I personally run a motorcycle oil called Spectro Golden 4 20w50. It is a synthetic/petroleum blend that has the uptreat of zinc and phosphurs for excellent anti-wear protection, shear stable polymer for extended stay in grade performance and Group IV base stocks for temp stability. I do not run a full synthetic (except in my outdrive) because I will never/don't need the major benifits of a full synthetic. Those being 1)long drain intervals. I change once a year approx. 25 hrs. 2) Extreme cold weather performance(startability/pourability). My boat is out of the water early fall. I will never use it in sub-zero weather and 3) high heat. Spectro Golden 4 will handle oil temps in excess of 300F. If my oil ever gets that hot I will need a bigger cooler. If my oils temps sees 250-275 I will be very surprised. Even then I have plenty of reserve. Ken

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

what's the difference between additives between the two then, also, which is preferred on this forum, the wix racing or the mobile extended oil filters?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Okay, i've now read the whole thread. My question about ZDDP has more or less been answered.

Still, the question remains, how cold is too cold for engine oil? Do I need an oil thermostat?

I've been running the 25w40 merc oil in my 502 mag. I'm at about 22 hrs right now on the oil, a bit over 100 on the engine since a rebuild last year. I changed filters and topped off last weekend, i'll probably put another 5-10 hours on the motor this season, tops. When I winterize i'm going to use the merc stuff again, with a fresh filter, and have the old stuff analyzed.

Next season, i'm thinking i'll run it once or twice with the oil that i'll put in when winterizing, then switch to the 20w50 M1 V-twin. I'm going to try to run it all summer, which will likely be 60-80 hrs depending on gas prices, but i'll do an analysis and filter change every 20 hrs for peace of mind.

Not sure what to do with the outdrive. This year i put in fresh merc HP gear lube in the spring, it's still in there. Not sure whether to change in the fall or let it sit until spring. Thinking i'll change it in the fall and maybe again in the spring. Not sure if i want to stick with the merc stuff or go with the amsoil synthetic marine gear lube. Does blackstone do analysis of the gear lube?

When i send the oil in to blackstone, should i spring the extra for the "dyson" report? http://www.blackstone-labs.com/dyson_analysis.html

Good thread, lots of good info here.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Mixguy - thanks for your quick repsonse. Where can I purchase the Sprectro Golden 4 20w-50? You obviously like this better than anything that Mobil 1 has to offer? I plan to change oil 2x a year, with never more than 20-25 hours between changes. Does this oil contain the same qualities as Mobil 15-50 which I understand so many are using?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

If you are talking about the differences in additives between M1 15w50 and M1 20w50 I would think that Mobil would use the same additive technology in both. If an analysis was done on each oil (when new) you would see that the additive content would be close. I am talking automotive here. I was talking viscosity. I prefer to run a 20w50 in a boat rather than a 15w50. You must remember who "drives" the oil industry, it's the automakers, they are the people who want thinner fluids for better fuel economy, lower levels of anti-wear for emission contol system life,long drain intervals etc. It's not the oil company. Oil filters? My only advice is when people talk micron size ask if it absolute or nominal. With a nominal filter of say 50 microns a particle 49 microns in diameter 200 microns long could possibly get thru the filter where in an absolute filter it would be stopped. Ken

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Any good motorcycle shop has it or can get it, or call Spectro direct 1-800-2getoil (1-800-243-8645) As far as additive levels Spectro Golden 4 (because it is a motorcycle oil) will contain a higher level of anti-wear than M1 15w50 which is an automotive product. Changing at 20-25 hours with this product will be fine. Ken

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I am sure that Blackstone does gear lube analysis. As I have stated before on this thread, when you send out to do an oil analysis of your used oil you should also send a sample of your oil when new. The new oil sample will give you a baseline of the exact oil that you have in your engine. You will know the viscosity when new, your PPM of additive. You than can compare new vs used and see how much viscosity loss (if any) you have. Your 20w50 may have "fallen out of grade" and is no longer a 50 at 210F. It may now be a 40 of god forbid a 30. The best report is one that has to do with your oil and your engine. When you start to bring universal averages in the mix you have too many different engines as well as oil types. There could be non-detergent oil results which can skew the ua's.
I personally think oil should be at a minimum temp of 180F. You must remember that they test at 210F. If your oil is not reaching 180 I would think you are overcooling. Oil life is shortened at cooler temps, ie sludge build up. Ken

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

wow lots of info loved it i am glade i can't fire myself for taking the time to read it. this is what i am going to use on both Eng. M1 20-50 v twin, pure power oil filter # 8445 , 219deg. therm controled 3" oil coolers 12 qt. pans for a cat amsoil sever duty gear oil in the bravo 1 and ramco flomax 300m gas filters the only thing i changed was to go from amsoil 60w racing to the m1 20-50 v twin p.s. did the break in on rotella and fram hp 6 filters i aslo have filter mags i run them on my cars custom bikes and trikes thanks for all the info

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I found some Spectro Golden 4 for $7/qt. Does that seem about right? Anything else in this price range that I should be considering? Thanks. This oil is a synthetic blend. Is this as good as the Mobil v-twin 20-50?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Does mobil have just a 20W-50, or is the only 20W-50 they make have the v-twin label on it. I could have sworn i saw the 20W-50 at farm and fleet, but without the v-twin lable??

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Mobil 20W-50 V-Twin is the worlds best 20W-50 Fully Synthetic Oil as it can handle more heat before flashing into flame than any other oil.

It's additive package is the best around.

Nothing but nothing beats this product for gasoline engines.

Anything else is #2.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Is there such thing as mobil's 20W-50 and not being the v-twin formula?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Mixguy chooses Spectro Golden 4 as his oil of choice which is a blend. While Mobil 15w-50 and Mobil v-twin 20w-50 are synthetics. I am looking for an oil to change to after my break in oil (Valvoline 40). With a pair of 540s, how would you rank the above mentioned oils for my application? I am not looking to buy the most expensive oil, unless the others will not provide the needed protection. Thanks.

I found Mobil 15w-50 at $7 and v-twin 20w-50 at $9.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I just saw the mobil 15W-50 for $28 for the 5-quart jug, and 6.46 a quart at Walmart........

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

It's the only fully synthetic 20w50 Mobil makes. The labeling is for marketing purposes. It is a "4-cycle engine oil".

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

My WallLand will take an order and get you as many 5 quart jugs as you want.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

GOTCHA, i ended up going with the Mobil 15W-30 and the mobile 302 filter

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I just contacted the local Wal-Mart and they have the same deal with the Mobil 1 15w-50. Not a bad price $28. Is this better to use than the Spectro Golden 4 or about the same qualities?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Spectro Platinum Fully Synthetic PAO IV is equal I would say.

Spectro Golden 4 Blend is not nearly as good as M-1.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Don't forget about these 2 strong oils:

http://www.modernoils.com/Series_2000_20w50.html
http://www.modernoils.com/MCV_20W50.html

Also look at this test. It is about motorcycle oils but still provides good info about a couple of the oils in this discussion.
http://www.modernoils.com/media/pdf_...Comparison.pdf

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Amsoil and Mobil are in my mind equal more or less because Amsoil buys their PAO Group IV base from Mobil and then designs it's additive chemistry to it.

They used to blend in some Group V base into the Series 3000 oils but that is too expensive now.

So my money is on the premium Amsoil products or Mobil.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Even as a preferred customer, isn't the Amsoil 20w-50 more expensive than the Mobil 15w-50? Does anyone know the price of the Amsoil? Thanks.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I'm sure it is. I think I pay just under $7 a quart for the Amsoil. Can't imagine paying retail for it. :eek: But it's proven to be worth it to me after running it 1 season so far.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

It depends on what AMSOIL 20w-50 you are looking at and the quantity that you purchase.

An easy way to find out what the Preferred Customer prices are is to follow the instructions here http://www.modernoils.com/Purchase_at_Dealer_Cost.html . Once you add the PC membership to your cart all prices are at wholesale cost.

Real simple. There is also a link to a Free Catalog on that page.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

where can I get the v-twin 20w50? I looked at wally world, they didn't have it. autozone, etc. don't have it either.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I looked at the Amsoil site. What 20w-50 oil is everyone using? I did see a motorcyle oil, is that the one? Since I am already a preferred customer, I was seriously comparing Mobil 1 products. Thanks.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

For overall performance it would be between the TSO Series 2000 and the MCV Motorcycle Oil. The TSO will have a slightly better base stock while the MCV has a better anti-corrosion package. The ARO 20w-50 is a very good value and is a proven formula, not bad for under $6 per qt.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Try advanced auto parts

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I buy it at VIP Auto Patrs.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Here is the scoop on Amsoil products:


Amsoil SAE 20W-50 Synthetic High Performance Motor Oil (ARO) $7.75/qt Most similiar to M-1 15W-50 of all their products.

Amsoil Series 2000 Synthetic 20W-50 Racing Oil (TRO) $9.25/qt
Similiar to M-1 V-twin BUT it has more friction reduction additives.

Amsoil SAE 60 Synthetic Racing Oil (AHR) $9.50/qt
Got a big blower or similiar set-up where fuel gets into the oil and dilutes it? This is for engines such as a Sterling Blower 1200+ HP.

Amsoil SAE 20W-50 Synthetic Motorcycle Oil (MCV) $9.10/qt
About even with M-1 V-Twin.

Amsoil discount if a dealer is 15% off I think...makes up for UPS shipping?

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Here are the Preferred Customer prices on the above oils.

Amsoil SAE 20W-50 Synthetic High Performance Motor Oil (ARO)
$5.90
$67.20 for case of 12 qts / $5.60 qt

Amsoil Series 2000 Synthetic 20W-50 Racing Oil (TRO)
$7.15 qt
$81.60 for case / $6.80 qt

Amsoil SAE 60 Synthetic Racing Oil (AHR)
$7.45 qt
$84.60 for case / $7.05 qt

Amsoil SAE 20W-50 Synthetic Motorcycle Oil (MCV)
$6.80 qt
$77.40 for case / $6.45 qt

No need to be a dealer to get these dealer prices. Just do the preferred customer thing at these instructions. http://www.modernoils.com/Purchase_at_Dealer_Cost.html This makes it super easy to get AMSOIL at dealer cost which is generally 20-25% off retail prices. I believe shipping is only about $8.50 for a case and since it goes by the pound with lower rates for larger orders you save quite a bit in the long run.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Thanks for all of the information on the Amsoil products. Ok, I am really confused on what I need for my specific application. I have newly built 540s, 700 hp NA, plan on about 20-25 hours between oil changes. Currently, have the break in 40w Valvoline racing with Wix filters (12 hours). If I were choosing an Amsoil product, which one would you suggest? Typical boating, a little racing and a little cruising. WOT @ 5800.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Amsoil ARO 20W-50 is the one that will fit your needs best especially with 25 hour changes.

Your mills will do great as I know guys who use this and get great results. No sludge. Instant pressure on start-up. The right oil temps.

Use with confidence.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Is there any oil either Mobil or Amsoil that would be good for 40 hours (my entire season). I am asking this to determine if there is any oil that you would feel comfortable leaving in for the entire season? If not, I will stay with Mobile 15w-50 or Amsoil 20w-50. Thanks.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Either of those products you mentioned would do fine out to 50 hours.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Thanks for the comments and suggestions, but I'll have to wait a couple of years to make the change to synthetic. My engine builder said he won't warranty the engines if I don't use Valvoline VRI 40. The warranty means a lot in the world of performance!

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

http://www.valvoline.com/pages/produ...asp?product=95

Your Valvoline VRI now comes in synthetic...I would show your builder this as it is the exact same formulation of additives etc. but has a stronger base and is rated 20W-50 for faster starts and better heat protection at the top as well.


By the way folks..this is real close to M-1 V-Twin in ZDDP levels...gotta be a great product and one I would try. :D

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

Thanks for the information, I'll pass the information along. Another question, I am now using 70w-90 Amsoil in my Bravos. Is this a better product than the Mercury lube? It seems pretty thin, but I've read where others have been using.

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

If you ask the Amsoil guys who have a booth at OSO races they will tell you not to use the Universal Marine lube in an "offshore rig" but to use Severe Gear...I think the Marine product is nice for a runabout but too thin for offshore applications as well.

Asmoil made a mistake in my opinion of discontinuing their Series 2000 Marine gear lube. I know Teague liked it a lot as did Imco.

Go with this stuff below is my call as it is what your drives need...High Pressure Lube Additives..aka ZDDP and plenty of it.

Severe Gear seems to be a cut above the green stuff. :p

https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/svg.aspx

Re: Marine Lubrication
 

I use Mobile One gear oil in my Kaama's. I think it's 75/90 wt.