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Marine Lubrication
I thought we should have one thread on nothing but oil and lubes and keep everything in one place for easy reference...so let the thread begin...
The most asked question are oil filter cross-reference..here is the list i can update it as time goes on. Oil Filter f/ most Mercruisers FYI:The thread type on the filter is 13/16-16. Fram: PH5, HP4, DG5, PH13 (no anti drainback) Pureolator: L34631 Purolator Pure One: PL34631 AC: PF1218, PF932 Motorcraft: FL-12A NAPA: 1060, 1060gold Wix: 51060 Wix Racing: 51060R, 51061R R= Racing K&N: HP3002 Baldwin: B1428 (Top Rated) Amsoil: SDF-24 Hastings: LF279 Fleetguard: LF3679 Mercruiser: 35-802885Q Mobil 1: M1-302 or M1-111 Kendall: K31 Penzoil: PZ45 Quaker State: QS5 Shell: S63, SH38 Texaco: T38, T38B Warner: PH1218 STP: S01218 Valvoline: V056 |
Re: Marine Lubrication
I received a question today regarding which oils get up to temperature faster. Here is an opinion:
An engine will get up to operating temperature faster with a thicker oil because the oil doesn't absorb as much heat as quickly. So, the enigne is warmer faster because the oil isn't absorbing the heat. As the engine gets warmer, the oil will absorb more heat, but not as fast as thinner oil. A thinner oil will absorb more heat quicker, not allowing the engine to get up to temp as quickly. So, I think the answer to this question would depend on many variables. Engine, oil capacity, volume of oil being pumped, load on the engine, etc... One engine may get the oil up to temp quicker with a thin oil while another may get the oil up to temp quicker with a thicker oil. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Oil flow and pressure dynamics. I think we need to understand some of this to have intelligent discussions pertaining about oil pressures with various viscosity and types of oil so here goes:
I am going to bring up the constant flow pump concept. First, it goes back to the principal that doubling the pressure of the same weight oil does not exactly double the flow but it is close. Also doubling the RPM for the same reason does not exactly double the flow but again it is close. This shows the problem best: (A) For a 30 wt oil at operating temperature: RPM....Pressure..Flow 1,000......20 PSI....1 2,000......40 PSI....2 4,000......80 PSI....4 8,000... 160 PSI....8 The maximum flow because of the oil pop off valve at 90 PSI will be 5 (B) For a 30 wt oil at operating temperature and a higher output oil pump: RPM....Pressure..Flow 1,000......30 PSI....1.5 2,000......60 PSI....3 4,000....120 PSI....6 The maximum flow because of the oil pop off valve at 90 PSI will be 5 8,000... 240 PSI....12 If we stick with the same weight oil and increase the oil pump output we will increase the pressure and the oil flow too. If we double the oil pump output we will double the pressure and we will double the oil flow. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Additives available for use in an oil/lubes and what they do:
Here is a comprehensive list (best you'll find outside of the lab) of multifunctional additives and their functions. Notice the same chemicals and compounds perform more than one function. Multifunctional Additives (in Alphabetical Order) listed as to Functional Agent, additive category, general or specific chemical compound, and how it works, respectively. Antifoamants or foam inhibitors (Protective Additive): polymers such as silicone polymers and organic copolymers of the silaxane's; creates a lens that reduces the bubble's surface tension. Antioxidants or oxidation inhibitors (Protective Additive): ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, aromatic amines such as organic tolutriazoles, thiadiazoles, diphenylamines, olefin sulfides, carboxylic acids; decomposes peroxides and terminates free radical reactions. Increases temperature of base oil at which base oil may tend to oxidize. Oxidation of oil promotes polymerization of sludge particles and increases viscosity. Anti-Wear and Extreme Pressure Additives (Surface Protective Additive): ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, Organic Sulfur-Phosphorus-Nitrogen compounds, Borates and Borate Esters, Tricresyl Phosphates, amine phostphates, and other phosphate esters, Chlorine compounds, and lead diamylcarbamates, lead and barium naphthenates, sulfurized olefins; protective film interacts at various temperatures and pressures to provide either a plastic interface or to provide a compound which shears at the surface. Demulsifier (Performance Additive): hydroxyalkyl carboxylic esters, alkenlycarboxylic esters; keeps water separated from lubricant. Detergents (Surface Protective Additive): metallo-organic compounds of sodium, calcium, magnesium, boron phenolates, phosphates and sulfonates such as alkylbenzene sulfonic acids, alkylphenol sulfides, alkylsalacyclic acids; Lift deposits from surfaces to keep them suspended. Dispersants (Surface Protective Additive): Alkylsuccinimides, alkylsuccinic esters (alkenyl succinimides); chemical reaction with sludge and varnish precursors to keep them acid neutralized and to keep them soluble. Detergent-dispersants often are the same chemical or come in compounds to accomplish the combined function(s). Emulsifiers (Protective Additive): Polyisobutylenesuccinimides, alkenylsuccinate ester/salts. polyester amides, alkyl aminoesters; promotes a stable emulsion or mixture of oil and water. Friction Modifiers or Friction Reducers (Performance Additive): Organic fatty acids and amides, lard oil, high molecular weight organic phosphorus and phosphoric acid esters such as Tricresyl Phosphates, ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, family of diphenylamines and amides, and olefin sulfides. Reduces coefficient of friction formulated lubricant in the boundary lubrication regime. Some VII's also provide friction reduction. Metal Deactivator (Protective Additive): ZDDP, ZTDC, Moly TDC, Antimony TDC, family of diphenylamines and amides, and olefin sulfides, heterocyclic sulfur-nitrogen compounds; inhibits corrosive effects of oxygen with metals and decreases metal interaction with oxygen compounds to reduce oxidation of oil. Oxidation Inhibitors (See Antioxidants). Rust Inhibitor (Surface Protective Additive): Barium sulfonates, amine phosphates, phosphordithioates, sodium thizoles (for coolants), Pour Point Depressant (Performance Additive): polymethacrylates (PMA's); reducing wax crystal formation and increases solvency of oil at low temperatures. May be part of VII package. Seal Swell (Performance Additive): nitriles, specific esters, organic phosphates and aromatic hydrocarbons. Increases volume of elastomeric seals. Surfactants or Surface Active Agents (Protective Additive): family of diphenylamines and amides; usually part of the antioxidant package. Also provides enhanced friction reduction and allows oils to "climb" or spread on and over surfaces. Decreases but does not destroy surface tension Soot Control or Soot Inhibitor (Protective Additive for diesels): Organic Barium compounds; keeps soot in suspension. Usually part of the dispersant package in diesel formulations. Tackifiers (Performance Enhancement): copolymers of ethylene and propylene; helps oil cling to surfaces. Very useful in geared machines such as transmissions, differentials, and chains. Viscosity Index Improver or Viscosity Modifier (Performance Additive): Olefin copolymers (OCP's), hydrogentated styrene-diene copolymers, styrene esters, polymetharylates (PMA's), mixed alkyl methacrylate-vinyl-pyrrolidines, aminated ethylene propylene, mixed alkylmethacrylate ethylene/propylenes; reduces viscosity change with temperature. Increases viscosity of base oil as temperature rises when base oil tends to thin. Some VII's may also act as dispersants by incorporating dispersant compounds. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Oil Technical data 2005
This site is closed that i previously posted..so I will provide it as needed. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Bob's and others Oil abbreviations:
AB Alkylated Benzene ACEA Association of Constructors of European Automobiles ADBV Anti Drain Back Valve AN Alkylated Naphthalenes API American Petroleum Institute ASTM American Society for Testing and Materials ATF Automatic Transmission Fluid AW Anti-Wear Agents Auto-Rx Auto-Rx BC Belgian Castrol 5w40 Base Oil Groups link to Chevron page BITOG BobIsTheOilGuy forum COC Cleveland Open Cup COF Coefficient of Friction CR Compression Ratio D1 Delvac 1 synthetic HDEO DOHC Double OverHead Cams EP Extreme Pressure FP Fuel Power FM's Friction Modifiers GC German Castrol HDEO Heavy Duty Engine Oil HOAT Hybrid coolant, Hybrid Organic Acid Technology HTHS High-Temperature High-Shear LC Lube Control M1 Mobil 1 synthetic oil MMO Marvel Mystery Oil MoDTC Molybdenum DialkyldiThioCarbamate Moly Molybdenum MTF Manual Transmission Fluid ND Non Detergent motor oil OCI Oil Change Interval OHC OverHead Cam OHV OverHead Valve PCMO Passenger Car Motor Oil PAO PolyAlphaOlefin POE PolyOlEster PCV Positive Crankcase Ventilation PTFE PolyTetraFluoroEthylene(TEFLON) QS Quaker State motor oil RP Royal Purple motor oil RBOT Rotating Bomb Oxidation Test RTS Rotella T Synthetic 5w-40 SAE Society of Automotive Engineers SbTDC Antimony DialkyldiThioCarbamate SX-UP/Sucks-Up SX-UP/Sucks-Up TAN Total Acid Number TBN Total Base Number TSB Technical Service Bulletin TOST Turbine Oxidation Stability Test UOA Used Oil Analysis VOA Virgin Oil Analysis VI Viscosity Index VII Viscosity Index Improvers ZDDP Zinc Dialkyl Dithiophosphate Z-Oil German Castrol(GC) |
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Oil Filter company #'s
Filter Companies contact number: AC Delco: 1-800-233-3526 Punch 1, then 4. Baldwin: 1-800-882-5394 Punch 1, then 2. Champ: 1-800-882-0890 Direct line Donaldson: 1-800-374-1374 Punch 2 for cross ref, punch 3 for technical Fleetguard: 1-800 223-4583 Punch 1 for cross ref, punch 3 for technical Fram: 1-800-890-2075 Punch 1 Purolator: 1-800-526-4250 Direct line Wix: 1-800-949-6698 Punch 4 |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Who makes what filter?
Updated List; Fram Fram Extra Guard (std) Fram Tough Guard (different media?) Fram X2 (Silicone ADBV, Fuzzy media) Fram Extended Guard(same as the X2) Mileguard (Jiffy) Honda (although some are alleged to be made by Filtech) Chrysler line up except for the Cummins Penzoil Deffense Canadian Tire Champion Labs Bosch Car and Driver Deutsch Mobil 1 STP SuperTech K&N Valvoline filters Mighty Service Champ Lee AutoZone Value Craft Some AC Delco VW (some) Warner Luberfiner Trust Wix Carquest blue Carquest red Napa Gold Napa Silver (lower quality with nitrile ADBV) Kralinator (in Canada) ALLIANCE (Freightliner aftermarket) Purolator (Arvin Meritor) Purolator premium plus (nitrile adbv) Purolator Pure One (silicone adbv, different media) Havoline Maxlife Valvoline (some) Group7 Promotive Powerflow Quaker State (less media) Advanced Auto Total Grip. (less media) Pep Boys Pro Line MotorCraft Superflo Denso Toyota Mann+Hummel Mann Volvo Clarcor Baldwin Hastings Amsoil Casite |
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Re: Marine Lubrication
How M-1 tested Mobil EP:
http://www.exxonmobil.com/corporate/...tml/story9.asp "Testing the new grades “The goal was to design these oils to perform well in difficult situations such as harsh climate extremes and different types of driving styles,” says Bill Buck, section head, Passenger Vehicle Lubrication Development, ExxonMobil Research and Engineering Company. Starting in the laboratory, ExxonMobil researchers developed a series of relatively basic bench-top experiments to test the new grades. From there the trials progressed to more sophisticated procedures that involved real engines and simulated actual driving conditions. Once the experimental oil earned a passing grade in the lab, more strenuous exercises followed. Still in a controlled environment, the oils were poured into the engines of cars placed on a system of rollers. Thanks to an external fuel line that never let the gas tank reach empty, the vehicles ran for 210,000 miles, with short stops every 15,000 miles for oil drains and scheduled light maintenance. A computer-controlled program replicated some of the worst driving conditions imaginable to further push the lubricant’s capabilities. And even then, ExxonMobil scientists looked for further proof that the oils met all requirements. The toughest test of all “When we were sure we had gotten it right in the lab,” says Buck, “we moved to the ‘real’ test — taxicabs in Las Vegas, Nevada.” Buck describes Las Vegas as the “gold standard for testing,” noting that, “the driving conditions there are some of the most severe in the United States. Most of the cabs run 20 to 22 hours a day, with short downtimes for refueling and a change of drivers. With daytime temperatures that can reach 110 degrees Fahrenheit, the air conditioning runs all day and puts a lot of strain on the engines. And even though most of the trips are short, an average vehicle can put on 8,000 to 10,000 very hard miles a month, with lots of idling and quick starts and stops. So it’s a good place to see how your motor oil will stand up to extraordinary punishment.” After extensive testing, all four grades “hit the jackpot.” Across the board, the results surpassed expectations, especially in terms of oil thickening, a persistent problem experienced by lesser-quality grades" . |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Do you ever sleep? Did you go on vacation to start a new thread? Thanks for all the info.I am burning up my printer at this very moment. :D
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Re: Marine Lubrication
FYI:
Recent tests of Mobil-1 15W-50 EP and Mobil-1 20W-50 V-Twin: The virgin analysis data is showing now that the two oils are very similar in additives. V-twin is a higher viscosity and holds a Visc. cST of 19.9 @ 100*C where the 15W-50 is @ 17.9. V-Twin ZDDP.....ZInc 1823 P 1683 15W-50 EP ZDDP...Zinc 1376 P 1223 |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Originally Posted by LILGUY
Do you ever sleep? Did you go on vacation to start a new thread? Thanks for all the info.I am burning up my printer at this very moment. :D
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Re: Marine Lubrication
Penzoil Platinum and other info:
Pennzoil Platinum - EOP base stock and additive package produced by Shell Chemical ethylene-alphaolefin polymer. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Redline's statement on extended drains with their oils:
Red Line stands alone in the ability to provide extended drain intervals and lower friction and wear. Red Line Synthetic oils have been shown to last 25,000 miles in field tests; however we recommend shorter drain intervals in order to provide a margin of safety with the oil. We recommend draining the oil between 12,000 and 18,000 miles depending on the type of service and the degree of blow-by gases contaminating the oil. High-speed freeway driving is easy on the oil due to its excellent thermal stability. If the engine is worn and if considerable stop-and-go driving is involved, 10,000-12,000 mile drains are suggested. A good rule of thumb to follow is to change the oil at least once a year regardless the mileage. Manufacturers warranty requirements should be followed while under warranty. Filters can be changed every 5,000 to 7,500 miles in order to assure filter durability is not a problem. Red Line makes a 15W40 Diesel Engine Oil for diesel engines. The diesel engine oils contain significantly greater detergency and total base number (TBN) which helps keep the engine clean. This additional detergency is not recommended for gasoline engines since it could increase the tendency for spark plug fouling. Even though the Red Line Motor Oils meet the specifications for diesel engines, the Diesel Engine Oil should be used where extended drains (10,000 miles +) are required. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Need a 0W-40 for a foreign car?..these passed the test..
These SHEAR STABIL 0w-40 oils do a great job as Factory fill lubricants around the world; Addinol - UltraLight MV Agip - Tecsint Aral - Supertronic BP - Visco 5000 Castrol - Formula RS DEA - Ultec Syn-T Mobil - M1 (SuperSyn) Gruppa Lotos - Lotos Syntetic Motul - 8100 Ester "E"-Tech Motul - Synergie Ester+ Novokvibyshevsk - U Tech Sys Shell - Helix Ultra Spectr Auto Industries - Prolarm Valvoline - Synpro Valvoline - Synpower Westfalen - Gigatron There are more too - no Amsoil products of course because they THICKEN don't they! |
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Where I suggest you get your oil analyzed..if you choose to do so:
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/index.html |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Synthetic oil costs too much? Read this..
Many of you are curious as to pricing structures for synthetics. Here is a cost model making the assumption that you are a blender buying all of your materials from a supplier, and you are also buying in 55 gal drum quantities (or more). Now these are appromomate costs and will very with market price and supplier. Case 1: For a 80/20 full synthetic per quart. 1. 80% PAO - $1.60 2. 20% TMP Ester - $0.70 ---------------------------------------- Cost of base oil: $2.30 3. Additive pkg. $1.27 Total Oil: $3.57/qt. Add to this packaging, advertising, support staff, chemistry research, testing and development, and GOVERMENT REGULATIONS, you need to sell this quart for approx. $5.36/qt. or more. . |
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I want you interested folks to read these last 2 pages so we can have intelligent conversations or entertain intelligent questions. :D
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Re: Marine Lubrication
The publicity I think moved all my red cap. I think it's all gone!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
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I was asked what advantages motorcycle oil has over car oil:
According to oil and bike manufacturers their motorcycle oils have superior wear protection, engine cleanliness, high-temperature stability, lower volatility/lower oil consumption and often better anti-corrosion performance. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
1 Attachment(s)
VIscosity Charts..left click to blow up
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What is oil analysis:
What is Oil Analysis? Oil analysis involves sampling and analyzing oil for various properties and materials to monitor wear and contamination in an engine, transmission or hydraulic system. Sampling and analyzing on a regular basis establishes a baseline of normal wear and can help indicate when abnormal wear or contamination is occurring. Oil analysis works like this. Oil that has been inside any moving mechanical apparatus for a period of time reflects the exact condition of that assembly. Oil is in contact with engine or mechanical components as wear metallic trace particles enter the oil. These particles are so small they remain in suspension. Many products of the combustion process also will become trapped in the circulating oil. The oil becomes a working history of the machine. Particles caused by normal wear and operation will mix with the oil. Any externally caused contamination also enters the oil. By identifying and measuring these impurities, you get an indication of the rate of wear and of any excessive contamination. An oil analysis also will suggest methods to reduce accelerated wear and contamination. The typical oil analysis tests for the presence of a number of different materials to determine sources of wear, find dirt and other contamination, and even check for the use of appropriate lubricants. -Oil analysis can detect: -Fuel dilution of lubrication oil -Dirt contamination in the oil -Antifreeze in the oil -Excessive bearing wear -Misapplication of lubricants -Some wear is normal, but abnormal levels of a particular material can give an early warning of impending problems and possibly prevent a major breakdown. Early detection can: Reduce repair bills Reduce catastrophic failures Increase machinery life Reduce non-scheduled downtime Early detection with oil analysis can allow for corrective action such as repairing an air intake leak before major damage occurs. Probably one of the major advantages of an oil analysis program is being able to anticipate problems and schedule repair work to avoid downtime during a critical time of use. Physical Tests Some of the physical properties tested for and usually included in analysis of an oil sample are: -Antifreeze forms a gummy substance that may reduce oil flow. It leads to high oxidation, oil thickening, high acidity, and engine failure if not corrected. -Fuel dilution thins oil, lowers lubricating ability, and might drop oil pressure. This usually causes higher wear. -Oxidation measures gums, varnishes and oxidation products. High oxidation from oil used too hot or too long can leave sludge and varnish deposits and thicken the oil. -Total base number generally indicates the acid-neutralizing capacity still in the lubricant. -Total solids include ash, carbon, lead salts from gasoline engines, and oil oxidation. -Viscosity is a measure of an oil's resistance to flow. Oil may thin due to shear in multi-viscosity oils or by dilution with fuel. Oil may thicken from oxidation when run too long or too hot. Oil also may thicken from contamination by antifreeze, sugar and other materials |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Metal Tests..from bob's site
Some of the metals tested for and usually included in analysis of an oil sample and their potential sources are: Aluminum (Al): Thrust washers, bearings and pistons are made of this metal. High readings can be from piston skirt scuffing, excessive ring groove wear, broken thrust washers, etc. Boron, Magnesium, Calcium, Barium, Phosphorous, and Zinc: These metals are normally from the lubricating oil additive package. They involve detergents, dispersants, extreme-pressure additives, etc. Chromium (CR): Normally associated with piston rings. High levels can be caused by dirt coming through the air intake or broken rings. Copper (CU), Tin: These metals are normally from bearings or bushings and valve guides. Oil coolers also can contribute to copper readings along with some oil additives. In a new engine these results will normally be high during break-in, but will decline in a few hundred hours. Iron (Fe): This can come from many places in the engine such as liners, camshafts, crankshaft, valve train, timing gears, etc. Lead (Pb): Use of regular gasoline will cause very high test results. Also associated with bearing wear, but fuel source (leaded gasoline) and sampling contamination (use of galvanized containers for sampling) are critical in interpreting this metal. Silicon (Si): High readings generally indicate dirt or fine sand contamination from a leaking air intake system. This would act as an abrasive, causing excessive wear. Silicon is also used as a anti-foam agent in some oils. more on silicon Sodium (Na): High readings of this metal normally are associated with a coolant leak, but can be from an oil additive package. Taking an Oil Sample It is important to get an oil sample that is representative of all of the oil in the machine. Remember, your analysis will be based only on the sample that you send in for analysis. Always have the oil hot and thoroughly mixed before sampling. Handle hot drained oil with care — it could cause serious burns. The easiest way to obtain a sample may be when the oil is being drained for an oil change. Sampling at this time usually involves letting some of the oil drain and then catching a sample in an appropriate container. Samples also can be obtained without draining oil by suctioning out through plastic tubing routed down into the oil reservoir. In any case, it is important to have an appropriate container and follow sampling directions thoroughly. Remember, many of the tests are for measuring materials on a parts per million basis, so safe, effective sampling is needed. Cost and Convenience Cost of oil analysis will vary according to the laboratory and extent of the analysis. Typical charges are $10 to $30 per analysis. The expense easily can be justified if it alerts the owner of a major problem that can be corrected and will help prevent downtime when the machine is needed. Several companies have developed oil analysis kits that make oil analysis convenient. These kits include the sample bottles, suction pump and tubing, and possibly a pre-addressed, postage-paid mailing container. The reasonable cost and convenience of oil analysis for use makes it another management tool that should be considered by anyone wanting to do preventive maintenance. . Results Results of the laboratory analysis are typically returned in two to seven days after the lab receives the sample. Results are returned to the owner for review. The laboratory may note when the analysis shows an abnormal condition and issue a caution or recommendation accordingly (Figure 1). A typical analysis report is included in Table I. It shows how detection can predict engine problems. Other typical recommendations might be: Example 1: Bearing metals indicate wear Inspect all bearing areas for wear Resample at 1/2 interval Example 2: Unit is in satisfactory condition Resample at normal interval Example 3: Abrasion indicated Inspect air filtration system Upper cylinder wear indicated Excessive fuel dilution Resample at 1/2 interval Optimum Maintenance Interval Most maintenance experts realize the oil change intervals for both engines and transmissions are decided by the "average need." No two pieces of equipment have the same preventive maintenance needs. Each machine has different imperfections and is used under different conditions. Operators doing smaller or lighter jobs can cause different conditions on engines and transmission wear than those that occur during more extended use. When using oil analysis to determine maintenance intervals, there is little guesswork. Records show that some equipment can safely run two or three times longer than recommended intervals. The oil analysis may show that you are changing the oil more often than necessary — or not often enough. By eliminating too frequent oil changes, you reduce the cost for oil and servicing and also reduce the amount of used oil to deal with. This is an important pollution prevention method — reducing the source! Oil sample analysis saves you repair and maintenance dollars, has the potential to reduce used oil and increases resale value of equipment. These are average numbers used but depending on your type of equipment may be higher or lower. Most reports have charts listed on the back to explain the severity of that component in ppm. Table I. Engine problems predicted with oil analysis. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Indicator Acceptable Levels Engine Problem What to Check -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Silicon (Si) and Aluminum (Al) 10 to 30 ppm Dirt ingestion Air intake system, oil filter plugging, oil filler cap and breather, valve covers, oil supply Iron (Fe) 100 to 200 ppm Wear of cylinder liner, valve and gear train, oil pump, rust in system Excessive oil consumption, abnormal engine noise,performance problems, oil pressure, abnormal operating temperatures, stuck/broken piston rings Chromium (CR) 10 to 30 ppm Piston ring wear Excessive oil blow-by and oil consumption, oil degradation Copper (CU) 10 to 50 ppm Bearings and bushings wear, oil cooler passivating,radiator corrosion Coolant in engine oil, abnormal noise when operating at near stall speed Lead (Pb)* 40 to 100 ppm Bearing corrosion Extended oil change intervals Copper (CU) and Lead (Pb)* 10 to 50 ppm Bearing lining wear Oil pressure, abnormal engine noise, dirt being ingested in air intake, fuel dilution, extended oil drain intervals Aluminum (Al) 10 to 30 ppm Piston and piston thrust bearing wear Blow-by gases, oil consumption, power loss, abnormal engine noise Silver and Tin 2 to 5 ppm 10 to 30 ppm Wear of bearings Excessive oil consumption, abnormal engine noise, loss in oil pressure Viscosity Change Lack of lubrication Fuel dilution, blow-by gases, oil oxidation, carburetor choke, ignition timing, injectors, injector pump, oil pressure Water/Anti-freeze Coolant leak or condensation Coolant supply, gasket sealed, hose connection, oil filler cap and breather |
Re: Marine Lubrication
STATES OF LUBRICATION
HYDRODYNAMIC LUBRICATION The design of oil is to produce a film of oil between two mating surfaces which gives you the best protection against wear and creates a hydraulic pressure (elasto-hydrodynamic lubrication,EHL) between the two surfaces. Now under perfect conditions this type of lubrication will not allow wear. But in reality, this is not always the case.This takes us to the next state of lubrication. MIXED FILM LUBRICATION This is where lubrication is marginal. Under load conditions oil is squeezed under pressure. For example, during accelleration of an engine, you step on the gas and the engine dumps fuel, in turn the force is increased against the rod bearings, pushing (or squeezing) on the hydrodynamic oil creating a marginal lubrication condition. This is under normal use. But what happens to oil when it is under extreme pressure created by abuse or just a heavy foot? BOUNDARY LUBRICATION This is where lubrication is dependant on antiwear additives. What happens here, is lubrication can be put under so much pressure, and is momentarily squeezed out to such a point that if oil didn't have any antiwear additives, you would be metal to metal. This is the last line of defense for lubrication to protect your equipment. A common place where you see a lot of high levels of barrier lubricant is in gear lubes. Ever wonder what that rotten smell was? Yep, high levels of zinc, and phosphorus. These are the two most used antiwear wear additives used in oils today. |
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How does an oil 'lose' some of its viscosity in a engine?
Shear stability is a measure of the amount of viscosity an oil may lose during operation. Oil experiences very high stresses in certain areas of the engine such as in the oil pump, cam shaft area , piston rings, and any other areas where two mating surface areas squeeze the oil film out momentarily . Most multigrade engine oils contain special types of additives, called Viscosity Index Improvers, which are composed of very large, viscosity-controlling molecules. As the oil passes through the engine, these molecules are permanently sheared or torn apart over time, causing the additive to lose its viscosity-contributing advantages which reduces the oils ability to maintain its higher number. Synth Oils do not rely as much on special Viscosity Index Improver additives and will experience little permanent viscosity loss. The shear stability of an oil is measured by using both ASTM test methods D445 and D5275. First, the viscosity of an engine oil is measured. Then, the oil is exposed to severe shearing conditions by repeatedly pumping it through a specially-sized diesel fuel injection nozzle at high pressure. After shearing the oil, its viscosity is measured again. The percentage of viscosity lost is determined by comparing the second viscosity measurement with the original viscosity measurement. Although there are no specifications indicating required levels of shear stability for engine oils, lower percentages mean that an oil is more shear stable and will retain its viscosity better during operation. Bellow Oil is being sheared or squeezed out momentarily around the rings, also when the piston pushes down against the crank, it squeezes out the film around the top rod bearing allowing the bearings to scuff or wear. So does What does this shearing do to your oil and engine in the long term? When the oil film is sheared or squeezed out, then your protection is now reliant on barrier lubricant additives. Oil has 3 states of lubrication , Hydrodynamic, mixed film, and boundary(barrier). The best is Hydrodynamic which is nothing more than a flow of oil separating two mating surfaces. After a period of time shearing, the oil will lose it's ability to hold up to the same flow as before since the VI Improvers are breaking down causing the oil to thin down in grade. Once this happens, there is less film strength between the mating surfaces so it doesn't take as much for the oil to shear, therefore creating more heat which attacks the base oil even more and then starts to cause the oil to thicken up due to the excessive levels of heat and the broken down VI Improvers become a contaminant which added to the existing oil will continue to thicken and ultimately cause sludge if not changed in a reasonable time.. A lot of people believe that a full synth oil can protect better than a mineral based oil. Lets look at that scenario. If you have a 10w30 mineral oil, that means your base oil has measured to flow between 9.30-12.49 Cst's @ 100deg C. If you take a synth 10w30 base oil, that means your base oil(synth) has also measured to flow between the same 9.30-12.49 Cst's @ 100 deg C. What this shows is that when the piston is forced down from the explosion created by your spark plug a lot of pressure is being applied through the upper rod bearing against the crank to make the engine go. Now when the piston is on the up stroke, the other pistons are pushing the crank around so there is no real pressure on the bottom causing the oil to shear or squeeze out on the bottom bearing so there is very little wear against the bottom. So What does protect your engine when the hydrodynamic film is sheared? After the base oil has sheared or squeezed out, The last line of defense is an additive that puts down a barrier film. This additive usually has higher levels of strength against shearing so it helps keep the wear down. Alright, here's the catch. In 96, the lubrication industry changed from the SH to SJ API rated oil by reducing the barrier lubricant additives to help preserve cat converters on cars. Why?, It appears that the manufactures / lubrication experts are concerned with contaminating the cat converters with the standard antiwear additives in the motor oils so they have reduced the levels of antiwear additives to preserve the cats. Hmmm, guess what, When they introduced the new SL GF-3 oils, They left it the same. Ok, not out of the woods yet... GL4 oils were introduced around April 2005. Have a guess one of the things they are going to do?, YEP, reduce the current antiwear additives again. The interesting thing to note is that more and more oil companies are coming out with higher mileage motor oils with higher levels of the antiwear additives. Catch is, they are not API certified there fore can void engine warr's. Remember all those additive companies selling their miracle oil ? For some of them, they were doing nothing more than adding a barrier additive to your existing oil. Problem there, too much of a good thing can cause it to overload the blend that the oil company started with, so a lot of times the detergents in the oil are not able to do their job and fight acids produced by the engine, there fore the oil will oxidize faster and start the process of breakdown and extended oil drains are out of the question. not to mention engine warr issues again. Guess what a good race oil has... higher levels of antiwear and less detergents. Since they don't run race oils over the road, their not worried about oil drains. They change it constantly. Conclusion: The higher the spread between the bottom number and the top number the more VI improvers are relied on for maintaining the viscosity. Better to keep the numbers closer. All base oils film strength will shear under stress or pressure. The real way to help prevent wear is to maintain higher levels of antiwear additives This in conjunction with a good base stock which resists breakdown to high heat. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
MOLYBDENUM DISULFIDE
Molybdenum is a very hard metal with a number of industrial uses: It is combined with chromium in steel to make the steel harder and more resistant to bending. Most of the bicycle frames produced today use chromium and molybdenum steel. Because the steel is so much harder, the manufacturers can use less, thereby making the frame lighter. Molybdenum Disulfide (Moly) has been used for decades in lubricating pastes and greases because it is slippery and forms a protective coating on metal parts: Moly exists as microscopic hexagonal crystal platelets Several molecules make up one of these platelets. A single molecule of Moly contains two sulfur atoms and one molybdenum atom. Moly platelets are attracted to metal surfaces. This attraction and the force of moving engine parts rubbing across one another provide the necessary thermochemical reaction necessary for Moly to form an overlapping protective coating like armor on all of your engine parts. This protective armor coating has a number of properties that are very beneficial for your engine. The Moly platelets that make up the protective layers on your engine surfaces slide across one another very easily. Instead of metal rubbing against metal, you have Moly platelets moving across one another protecting and lubricating the metal engine parts. This coating effectively fills in the microscopic pores that cover the surface of all engine parts, making them smoother. This feature is important in providing an effective seal on the combustion chamber. By filling in the craters and pores Moly improves this seal allowing for more efficient combustion and engine performance. This overlapping coating of Moly also gives protection against loading (perpendicular) forces. These forces occur on the bearings, and lifters. The high pressures that occur between these moving parts tend to squeeze normal lubricants out. Eventually, there is metal to metal contact, which damages these moving parts and creates large amounts of heat. Fortunately, this is not the case with some lubricants.The layer of moly that forms on these moving surfaces can withstand pressures of 500,000 psi, without being squeezed out. Engineers and scientists have tried for years to use Moly in motor oils but they have been unsuccessful because they could not find a way to keep Moly in suspension. Once Moly was put into suspension it would gradually settle out. It was easy to see it come out of suspension because a black sludge would collect on the bottom of the oil containers. In engines it would settle to the bottom of the crankcase or clog oil pathways and filters. Engineers have overcome these obstacles. They have developed a process that keeps Moly in suspension and isn't filtered out. Since that time the product has undergone extensive independent testing in labs and in the field for many years to insure that the product stands up to the rigorous needs of today's engines. With the plating action of Moly reducing friction which reduces heat, this helps keep rings free from carbon buildup, prevents blow-by, decreases emission, and extends oil life. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Originally Posted by vandy021
The publicity I think moved all my red cap. I think it's all gone!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
You told us to wait till the 26th? |
Re: Marine Lubrication
The reason I am custom tailoring an educational site for us is because Offshore boats have very special needs that even Bob's site does not pretend to address. I hope you all take the time to read up on things.
I eventually want you all to be able to be familiar enough with what goes into a lubricant to be able to research it and make your own choices. I will be here for any questions as usual. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
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I received a question concerning a high performance oil for supercharged applications designed for racing.
Here is a suggestion or two: Amsoil SAE 60 Super Heavy Weight Racing Oil. http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/ahr.aspx Redline 60WT race oil http://www.redlineoil.com/products_m...46&subcatID=15 Usually used for the race and changed as they only have enough additives for a very short period of time but during that time offer extensive protection. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
Originally Posted by vandy021
The publicity I think moved all my red cap. I think it's all gone!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
Sometimes false alarms happen. They are rare and usually have an explanation. I think Goldcaps Extended competitors were posting information to defend their best interests. To protect the market they created that Goldcap Extended now threatens. Goldcap data keeps coming in and it looks good...even though the data is good we still have posts that suggest otherwise and they are unfounded. This happens with any new product to some extent. Goldcap is looking good according to recent data. Goldcap is a very good choice that may in time turn out to allow extended drains in the marine application as well but it is too early to tell. I am sorry for the scare..but it is over..Goldcap is going to be very good especially at the 25-50 hour drains we do. Happy shopping at Walmart and happy boating. :D |
Re: Marine Lubrication
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Amsoil's new 10W-40 & 10W-30 Marine oil to compete with Mercury and others in 4-stroke outboards
New AMSOIL Formula 4-Stroke® Marine Synthetic Motor Oils are premium quality synthetic formulations engineered for the harsh operating conditions of marine environments. They withstand the intense mechanical activity of continuous, high RPM operation to deliver superior viscosity protection. Formula 4-Stroke® Marine Synthetic Motor Oils are specially fortified with a heavy treatment of advanced additives that protect motors against wear, rust and deposits, and they excel in both high horsepower applications and all-day trolling conditions. Looks like a great 4-stroke outboard oil. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
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I was asked for another 20W-50 for racing that is synthetic but has more additives than a racing synthetic:
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/tro.aspx or http://www.redlineoil.com/products_m...45&subcatID=14 Remember there are 2 grades...Highperformance...and "Racing" Racing oils are for a single "race" usually. These oils here have more longevity built in. |
Re: Marine Lubrication
2 Attachment(s)
Amsoils new 20W-50 motorcycle synthetic oil. Looks like a winner.
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